Update: Picture removed becaause man has been cleared. This from Huffington Post:
Here is more on the person of interest, who according to NBC News has been ruled out: "Authorities tell NBC News they have interviewed the 'person of interest' in the Arizona shooting [and] are now satisfied he was merely at the Safeway store and not connected to the shooting or the suspect in any way."
The New York Times notes: "Investigators said that the second man was a taxi driver who drove the suspected gunman to the scene. Upon arriving there, the passenger said he did not have change and he and the taxi driver went into the supermarket for change and the two then walked out together and separated."
Update: In a news conference going on right now Sheriff Dupnik just stated that this second man may NOT have anything to do with the shooting.
A woman apparently helped to disarm the shooter, and was wounded herself. Gun misfired and two men tackled him. This woman is a hero, and may have saved multiple lives.
Right now the sheriff is very aggressively talking about the effects that vitriolic speech has on unbalanced people.
Called Arizona the "Tombstone of the United States of America" apparently referencing the famously lawless town of the old west.
I am REALLY starting to like this sheriff.
Update 2: Here is a portion of today's press conference with Sheriff Dupnik, courtesy of Firedoglake.
I have no idea how this sheriff managed to be elected in a place that has Jan Brewer as it's governor and John McCain representing it in the Senate, but Arizona should be proud to have him.
Update 3: Laughner has been charged with one count for an assassination attempt of a member of Congress, two counts for killing a federal employee, and two for attempting to kill federal employees.
1:12 PM and from a New York Times liveblog ..
ReplyDeleteFBI Director Robert Mueller said there is "no information at this time to suspect any specific threat remains" in the aftermath of the shooting in Arizona.
He declined to speculate about a motive for the shooting. And he did not comment on questions about laws in Arizona that allow people to carry concealed weapons.
He said his agency was working with other agencies to "ensure that justice is done."
Regarding the "person of interest" that was announced by the Pima County sherff, Mr. Mueller said they are trying to identify a man they believe entered the store with the suspect. He said they do not believe the second individual is involved in the actual shooting, "but we need to identify him."
Gryphen----could this be part of the Palin downfall you foretell? Please tell me that it's so!
ReplyDeleteWhile we all know about Sarah, we should also be looking at Jesse Kelly, the guy who ran against Giffords. He was endorsed by Palin on Fox News. His website looks like it has been recently scrubbed.
ReplyDeleteFireDogLake has more on him.
http://firedoglake.com/2011/01/08/giffords-opponent-jesse-kelly-held-june-event-to-shoot-a-fully-automatic-m16-to-get-on-target-and-remove-gabrielle-giffords/
Vinnie
http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/2010/05/02/20100502arizona-border-violence-mexico.html
ReplyDeleteIn this link from last year, the same Sheriff calls out the escalating media-driven politicalization of AZ border issues & violence. He has spoken out before.
Just like last March, it didn't take long for the right to decide that they are actually the victims here (http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2011/01/08/these-are-not-the-violent-extremists-you-are-looking-for/). And our stellar msm continues to support their delusions of victimization with CNN yesterday actually asking 'experts' if Republicans are now in increased danger because of liberal fanaticism in response to this shooting. Jeebus. I give up.
ReplyDeleteWitnesses said the stone-faced gunman first shot Giffords, who was chatting with a couple from a seat behind a table, before unloading up to as many as 20 shots on the crowd.
ReplyDelete"He was going for the congresswoman," Alex Villec, a 19-year-old volunteer, told the Arizona Daily Star. "A few staff members were caught in the crossfire. ... His goal was the congresswoman."
Because, I just have to say, by looking at him he seems a prime candidate to be part of a certain viewing demographic. If you know what I mean.
ReplyDelete--------------------------
Character assassination much?
What if this isn't the guy?
You're as bad as those on the far right.
Curious what kind of ratings Sarah's show is going to bring in tonight. Crickets. . .at least those that survive the Palin stomping shoes.
ReplyDeleteYep--I'm really liking the Sheriff more and more. Wish more people would speak out the obvious.
ReplyDelete~trish
Maybe a list of Jesse Kelly's donors will be of interest as well.
ReplyDeleteI am curious why the governor of the state was not at the press conference with the FBI Director and the sheriff?
ReplyDeleteGiven the high profile nature of the shooting and victims...seems that Brewer ought to be there.
Among the people who gave the impression that these were targets: Sarah Palin. When she announced the list in a tweet, she wrote "don't retreat, instead - RELOAD!" I'm not an expert surveyor, but I'm not sure what sort of tools need reloading. Jonathan Martin points out that after the election, Palin tweeted about her success (18 of the seats went to the GOP) by saying "remember months ago 'bullseye' icon used 2 target the 20 Obamacare-lovin' incumbent seats?" Throughout 2010, when Palin was criticized for the target map, she either didn't respond or mocked the "lamestream media" for interpreting her gun metaphors as calls for violence. At the Southern Republican Leadership Conference, for example, she got big applause when she said "Don't retreat, reload -- and that is not a call for violence!" The media wasn't going to force her to stop using the gun line.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.slate.com/BLOGS/blogs/weigel/archive/2011/01/09/palin-spox-targets-on-sarahpac-map-were-actually.aspx
Gryphen,
ReplyDeleteIf you're not going to jump to conclusions, then don't jump to conclusions:
Because, I just have to say, by looking at him he seems a prime candidate to be part of a certain viewing demographic. If you know what I mean.
I think anyone who tries to assign meaning to this guy's actions is misguided. He was disturbed, a chemical imbalance, a broken brain, pure and simple.
ReplyDeleteHaving watched a close friend battle mental illness for years now (assigned the label "delusional depression" by the shrinks) I have some feel for what goes on. They grab random things out of the air, off radio or television, or any random event off the street that might stick in their brains for whatever reason. Then they mash all this together into some bizarre and meaningless soup.
I became frustrated not with my crazy friend, but with all the sane people who tried desperately to assign meaning to all of his actions. They just could not get it, his actions had no meaning. A diseased mind is just that, diseased.
I'm not suggesting that irresponsible rhetoric is not to blame -- just the opposite. The conservative apologists are saying this was not politically motivated because than man was insane. They're right on one count, he was not motivated by politics, at least not directly. He was motivated by random memes he picked up from the culture around him.
To this guy, the rhetoric was all there was. It went in one ear, churned around inside his failing logic circuits, and came out the end of his 9mm pistol.
I was wondering if Mr. Kelly was a Minutemen but after checking, it appears to me that he is way too busy. I did find out who his backers were: here
ReplyDeletePerhaps there are "fixers" after all..as Sarah doesn't believe in coincidences.
I also wonder if the viewership will be down tonight for SPA.
ReplyDeleteCan we find out if the shooter was a Palin FB fan?
Someone has been able to ID the man and chances are he knows the officials want to hear from him. A man with nothing to hide would clear this up. Does he have the money to leave the area or can he stay behind closed doors? Is he getting a new hair color?
ReplyDeleteThe authorities are talking to a second person now. The reporters don't know if it is the same man.
This sounds like something Prevo would do??
ReplyDeleteWestboro Baptist Church protest at the funeral of those who died.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/09/westboro-baptist-church-arizona_n_806319.html
Levi's Vindication: The Self-Exposure Of Sarah Palin
ReplyDelete...But Palin could not help herself. She is drawn to the exposure of her own lies like a salmon into her husband's net.
This is called self-destructive behavior. And it soothes the troubled soul.
http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2011/01/levis-vindication-the-self-exposure-of-sarah-palin.html
I'm a little disappointed that you prejudged this man based on his appearance.
ReplyDeleteWould it be totally out of line to think some right wing, nutjob, survivalist, paramilitary group would be behind this. Perhaps telling their members to seek out some unbalanced individual (liberal a perk) to foster a friendship, nurture and groom them, indoctrinate them, and then aim them at a target predetermined by the group.
ReplyDeleteI can see such a group using Palin's gunsight map, feeding off of the hate speech and gun rhetoric of Palin, Bachmann and others.
Or am I just being paranoid?
There's certainly a lot of imagery to look at regarding the shooting of Rep. Gabrielle Giffords. The most troubling image I saw, however, occurred in the interview Giffords gave to MSNBC back in March after her office was vandalized following the health care vote.
ReplyDeleteSpecifically, I wanted to show you this one frame I grabbed from that interview. In describing how extremists were working people up and creating a dangerous atmosphere, Giffords not only cites Sarah Palin's Facebook graphic targeting Democratic Congressman for defeat in the mid-term election, Giffords actually demonstrates with her hands how Palin targeted her district with the crosshairs of a gun site. Studying this frame, it's hard to imagine a person would model her own fate this directly unless the atmosphere, the specificity of the suggestion and the blatant irresponsibility of Sarah Palin and right wing extremists didn't make it this predictable.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-shaw/reading-the-pictures-ithe_b_806333.html?ir=Media
FBI Director Robert Mueller needs to step down. The FBI is also working on the Wasilla Bible Church Arson. They won't even do an update or give a darn about solving the crimes. It should be important to Sarah followers and the Valley. You would think the community would be riled for answers. Instead an arsonist is on the loose. The FBI is failing along with the Anchorage Fire Department and other locals.
ReplyDeleteSarah Palin actually apologized "in case." Others called it an attempted murder and pointed the finger of blame.
In case the link didn't come through before:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/
articles/2010/05/02/20100502arizona-border-violence-mexico.html
More evidence of the sheriff's previous leadership on these media/politics/violence AZ issues, from 2010.
Seriously, I'm astounded that you would suggest that this man in the photograph might be guilty based on his appearance alone. I think you should remove that comment and apologize, it's as bad as suggesting the shooter must have been black or hispanic.
ReplyDeleteFrom Twitter/@bristo_palin (is this really Bristol Palin????)
ReplyDelete"You are a paid member of the "lame stream media" you're always referring to, mom. Fire all of your ghost writers and tweet for yourself :( "
Fox’s Geraldo On Arizona Shooting: “This Event Affects Sarah Palin’s Political Future”
ReplyDeleteLate Saturday night, Fox News Channel’s Geraldo Rivera, discussing the Arizona Safeway shooting that left Congresswoman Gabrielle Gifford injured and six others dead with Tea Party 365 co-founder David Webb, “went there” by invoking former Alaska governor Sarah Palin. Palin’s name has been linked to reports on Saturday’s shooting thanks, in part, to the “crosshair” imagery used in her so-called “Hit List” of 20 politicians, previously posted on website “Take Back the 20.”
“However unfair the link is,” said Rivera, “I think that this event affects Sarah Palin’s at least short term political future.” He then offered his prediction that, tomorrow, Palin’s name will (still) be tied to the media’s flurry of reports on the shooting, facing “criticism and scrutiny” for a perceived link to alleged gunman Jared Loughner.
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/foxs-geraldo-on-arizona-shooting-this-event-effects-sarah-palins-political-future/
From HuffPo updates:
ReplyDelete"Here is more on the person of interest, who according to NBC News has been ruled out: "Authorities tell NBC News they have interviewed the 'person of interest' in the Arizona shooting [and] are now satisfied he was merely at the Safeway store and not connected to the shooting or the suspect in any way."
Gryph - please update your post and perhaps remove the picture of the man....
"Hey, Sarah Palin, how’s that hatey, killy, reloady, chrosshairsy thing working out for ya?"
ReplyDeleteGryphon, you say: "I have no idea how this sheriff managed to be elected in a place that has Jan Brewer as its governor and John McCain representing it in the senate..."
ReplyDeleteTucson is different than the rest of the state, and especially different from Phoenix. It has a larger Democratic base, a larger centerist community, a larger progressive community, plus a strog enviromental lets-protect-our-Sonoran-desert community, a thriving arts community, a thriving gay community. It's also got a large air force based plunked down in the middle, a large, old, and well-established Mexican-American population, and two Native American nations: the Tohono O'Odham and the Yoeme (Yaqui). It's a diverse and friendly place, and sheriff like C;arence Dupnik comes as no surprise to those of us who live here.
Check out Bristol's latest tweet:
ReplyDeletehttp://twitter.com/bristol_palin
You are a paid member of the "lame stream media" you're always referring to, mom. Fire all of your ghost writers and tweet for yourself :(
Oh Gryph, one more thing: the Rep.'s name is Giffords, not Gifford.
ReplyDeleteThanks
Gryphen
ReplyDeleteSarah Jones at PoliticusUSA linked to you again. I think you'll like what she has to say.
http://www.politicususa.com/en/sarah-palins-mass-murders-obscene-left
By the way Rep. Grijalva, the other Tucson U.S. Rep is one of the most liberal in the house and one of my favorites.
ReplyDeleteCharacter assassination much? What if this isn't the guy? You're as bad as those on the far right.
ReplyDeleteThe law releases his photo as a person of interest in order for him to come forward and answer questions. He is just someone who was at the same store. No one has said he did anything other than be in the same place and possibly with the shooter. Some may think his dress is suspect? Oh well. Now law enforcement can't ask questions or look for persons of interest?
Eunice 10:22
ReplyDeleteThank you for posting that.
It's the drip, drip, drip of ad nauseam soundbyte chants - 'dont't retreat, reload', '2nd amendment soluations'. 'Tiller, the baby killer', etc,etc,etc.
It cannot be treated as the medical side separate from the political rhetoric. But they are trying.
I am going to hazard a wild guess that Sheriff Dupnik is not a life-long, bleeding heart liberal. Sounds like he's spent his entire life in law enforcement -- my guess is that, by most standards, he's pretty darned conservative. I'll hazard a further guess that he's among the thoughtful, educated conservatives who have been majorly put off by the Republican embrace of Palin & her Tea Party ilk.
ReplyDeleteLast guess is that he knows more than he's able to say.
Just read Andrew Sullivan's post re Boehner and Driehaus as reported by Matt Taibbi on January 5th, 2011. Three days BEFORE AZ. Totally on point:
ReplyDeletehttp://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2011/01/boehners-response.html
Gryph,
ReplyDeleteSheriff Dupnik was elected and re-elected since 1980 because this is Pima County not Maricopa County. Please do not brush my state with the broad brush.
@Eunice
Well said. As one who has a fairly significant case load of SMI (seriously mentally ill) clients I can attest to this.
Being a life long Phoenix resident I agree with Gryphn's description of how the Tucson Sheriff seems to be handling the situation. As an adult I have only ever seen an angry, irrational seemingly racist man for a sheriff, Joe Arpio, so I kinda thought they were all that way. Thank god for Tucson voters. Tucson is a very close knit community. My husbands Uncle is a speech writer for the congress woman and was present at the shooting. He was unharmed. My father-in law is a lawyer in Tucson, he knew the Judge that was murdered and said what everyone else is saying "he was a great/nice guy". This is all so horrific and senseless!. -E
ReplyDeleteHere's the link to the Above Top Secret website. They're fairly sure over there that he's been posting there. Wonder if the Feds know that yet?
ReplyDeletehttp://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread648608/pg1
Sheriff Dupnik has been Pima County Sheriff since 1980
ReplyDeletehttp://pimasheriff.org/about-us/meet-the-sheriff/
Doesn't sound like he'll be going anywhere soon like the unemployment line unless he decides!!
Keith O. just tweeted re the pic of the other person posted above:
ReplyDeleteMultiple outlets: "2nd man" in Tucson was cab driver who brought Loughner to scene, joined him in bank to get change, has been cleared.
Tucson and flagstaff are the bluest parts of the state. When I lived there in 2004 my co-workers wept when bush was re-elected.
ReplyDeleteThe report of the cancellation of Sarah Palin's Alaska came on the same day that the former vice president candidate was slammed for her vitriol on the back of the shooting of Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords.
ReplyDeletePalin had listed Mrs Giffords on her controversial Crosshairs Map which listed Representatives she wanted out of office leading up to the mid-term elections last November with a Don't Retreat, Reload message.
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/09/article-1345547-0CB336AE000005DC-978_468x291.jpg
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1345547/Sarah-Palins-reality-Alaska-axed-just-season.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
I don't think this man looks like he is a member of a particular group. He could be a typical older man of the area, another loner, on the fringe or a member of any number of groups. It doesn't matter what opinion any of us have about him. I hope he is guilt free and stable enough to come forward and clear things up. In any event it is imperative that the FBI learns more about what the man in custody did that day. They are also collecting pc and cell phone data.
ReplyDeleteNo one has mentioned the family where Loughner lived? No one is asking the neighbors questions? Remember when Sarah and Kristan Cole feared the kid they thought was going to Alaska and he was a danger to them? His parents spoke up about his previous threats, his problems and the situation. Loughner's family may be in shock but it is odd the LSM is not pursuing them.
The 2nd Amendment did give freewhite male Americans of military age the responsibility of owning a gun and of maintaining a certain amount of lead and gun power - so that the government (there was no military) could call these men up to form a militia to protect their communities and their country.
ReplyDeleteThe 2nd Amendment did not give free white male Americans of military age the right to fire the gun.
Much less did it give the right to shoot at other Americans, except as members of a Constitutionally defined government formed militia.
Of course the Republicans are never going to tell that to the wee wee'd up Tea Baggers.
Hey Sarah, the world is still waiting for you to condemn this act of political violence.
Mamma grizzlies should be howing at the death of a child as collateral damage in a political assassination and attempted assassination.
The longer you wait Sarah, the less sincere any statement you make will sound. But you cannot survive the PR of not condemning the murder of a Federal judge and the murder of an innocent child.
Eunice 10:22. Exactly right. Rational people (presumably most of us here) presume some rational motive, when there is none. This is much like the kid who shot up Virginia Tech, a mentally ill loner. He was in his own irrational, disturbed world, and the other "person of interest" had nothing to do with it.
ReplyDeleteBAustin - good point
ReplyDeleteWhere's Brewer.
Where is any one from Arizona except the one sheriff?
We can't really determine anything of that man in the screenshot other than he is middle aged. He kind of looks like a stereotypical mental patient though. If youre assuming hes a tea partier by said photo, you are way off base.
ReplyDeleteFrom what I've pieced together about Loughner, it appears he's atheist with posible homosexual tendencies. If true, it'll be very intersting to see how THAT guets spun in the media. (that was purely my conjecture please be aware. though I have seen it mentioned many other places)
Honestly, I don't think political affiliations are going to end up mattering in this crime. The only one at fault is the actual killer and any physical accomplices.
Now that Sarah Palin's aides are trying to deny that the crosshairs on her now-infamous map were not really crosshairs, a Facebook note, written around the same time as the map was published, has come to light full gun metaphors, including "crosshairs".
ReplyDeleteAt first glance, it might look like a note about basketball, but the gun references are unmistakable.
Standing alone, the note may not be all that remarkable. Taken together with the map and her "reload" message of twitter, there was a clear pattern last spring of an individual who spoke freely without regard to consequences.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2011/1/9/934760/-Palin-Wrote-2010-Facebook-Note-Full-of-Gun-Metaphors
Palin and The Crosshairs Dog Whistle
ReplyDeleteI could list another twenty companies using crosshairs on their websites, in their logos and on their products. I didn't even touch gun ranges, which I'm sure has a veritable cornucopia of crosshair logos.
The fact is that Palin's map with the crosshairs was deliberate, intentional and a clear dog whistle to gun owners and the right wing across America. You combine that with heated rhetoric about losing America and the Grand Fascist Socialist Takeover and its no surprise that we saw the tragedy we did yesterday.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2011/1/9/934715/-Palin-and-The-Crosshairs-Dog-Whistle
The more Sarah used code words for war, revolution, armed uprisings, the more popular she became with a significant (but still small) minority. As we laughed at their misspelled signs, and pointed to their messages, we missed just how demented and dangerous this could turn out to be. Sure, some of us warned, worried, and wrote about Sarah and the danger she represented. Even then, we could not help but look at her as a bit of a joke, a Zaphod Beeblebrox-type goof who would never . . . who could never be elected.
ReplyDeleteIt worked. Too well. She remains popular with the Tea Bagger crowd, some of whom went out and bought their first books since high school. Several of her Tea Bagger candidates did incredibly well, and several even got elected to national office. The abject fear instilled on a daily basis since the 2008 election came home to roost, and the nation predictably reacted out of fear.
The House became Republican, even though we still have not repaired the incredible damage done by them earlier this century. Still, people did recall who ran things into the ground, and luckily the Senate remained in the hands of people who take the constitution and this country's future seriously.
Several people here have long predicted that Sarah's words and actions would eventually result in a crazy person going postal and probably taking a Democratic candidate or office holder out. Well, it happened.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2011/1/9/934729/-How-the-GOP-will-deal-with-Sarah-Palin
Sheriff Dupnik is extremely POPULAR in Tucson. In many ways, he is the polar opposite of Sheriff Joe, the yahoo buffoon Sheriff of Maricopa County.
ReplyDeleteGood news is that America has a tradition of perseverance and overcoming issues far beyond what we've had to deal with in recent decades. I continue to be a faithful patriot and believe very strongly in the USA and even its people, from the "dumb rednecks" to the "liberal hippie douches."
ReplyDeleteSadly, I do feel The Media has become a 4th branch of government, encroaching more and more into the realm of a sort of Orwellian "Ministry of Information." It is hard to tell where I blame the supplier or the demander, as well.
However, it's simply a matter of history how corrupt politicians screwed themselves over. They owned the airwaves before they were paid off by lobbyists to give them away to private companies - the same companies that now charge them to run their political ads on their channels, creating greater fund-raising corruption. It is a twisted cycle, for sure.
But, given that even 100 years ago, Billy Hearst was saying, "You provide the pictures - I'll provide the war," I tend to judge The Media pretty harshly as I feel it's a group that should have an even greater responsibility to The People than politicians, and yet they have never lived up to it. There's simply a conflict of interest when it comes to providing information and acquiring profit - it creates and maintains what economists would call an "informational advantage" leading to a massive gap in information provided. While I feel politicians ought to have The People's best interests at heart, we can accept and understand their desire to twist facts to suit their agendas. But media groups that attempt to claim they're fair and balanced do so simply to lull their audience into a false sense of security leading to their total lack of independent thought. This is then milked by politicians, blurring the lines of blame.
However, as I said, blame is difficult. I don't know if I should blame The Media for the product they provide or The People for clearly desiring such a product. I certainly don't blame the pornography industry for the blatant sexuality of the last 50 years.
They Have Blood On Their Hands
ReplyDeleteAs Kurt Vonnegut Jr. wrote in Breakfast of Champions: "Bad chemicals and bad ideas are the Yin and Yang of madness." Yes, the shooter was probably mentally unstable, which may account for "bad chemicals" in his brain, but where do you think the bad ideas came from?
The social context in which this horrific event took place was one of hatred and intolerance, promulgated by Sarah Palin, Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh, Sharon Angle and so many supposed leaders who irresponsibly and subtly (sometimes, not so subtly) fanned the flames of violence, hatred and intolerance.
Then, Ms. Mansour, went a step further with this unbelievable quote:
She added: "People who knew him said that he is left wing and very liberal. But that is not to say that I am blaming the left for him either."
Instead of taking this time to rethink the wisdom of gunsight maps and quotes like "don't retreat, reload", Sarah Palin's focus is on deflecting blame.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2011/1/9/934737/-They-Have-Blood-On-Their-Hands
Thank you, Sarah, for bringing us Mr. Dupnik!
ReplyDeleteThis was on my facebook newsfeed, (pol affiliation withheld because it doesnt matter)
ReplyDeletePalin's ad, I don't really care about, though I do find her overall rhetoric pretty distasteful. I mean, they are called "target districts." Painting targets on them is hardly a leap from what they've been referred to forever. The people who suggest that Palin's campaign ad triggered this shooting are the same people that blamed Marilyn Manson for Columbine. There's a little more to it than that.
The Media's continual bloodlust and desire to fan the flames of fear is what caused this. It encouraged politicians to do the same to get coverage and popular support. People's decade-long irrational delusional mentality that the sky is falling is what makes them both afraid enough to do stuff like this as well as distracted enough to not know what to blame (then, again, it's not like the 90s didn't have plenty of fear in it, as well - from the Oklahoma City Bombing to the aforementioned Columbine Killings). And, lest we forget the ending of the Tale of Chicken Little. All the animals, lost with fear of their nonexistent impending doom, are duped into the den of a fox, who eats them all.
On a positive note, the American homicide rate continues to fall, kidnappings and child molestations have been the same since the 1930s, life expectancy has doubled since that same era and continues to climb steadily, and the amount of everything from gang violence to drug use to schoolyard bullying has steadily decreased over the last decade.
The sky is not falling.
We live in a beautiful world where, sometimes, psychopaths do crazy stuff.
The awful part is, politicians of each party (dem, TEA, and gop) are wrongfully targeted and threatened by enemies. JD Hayworth for example. The crazies are nonpartial to parties. That at least has been proven
ReplyDeleteThat Sheriff is smart and brave. I wish more people would speak the truth about what is happening to this country.
ReplyDeleteSheriff Dupnik - Our country needs more law enforement personnel like you!
mlaiuppa 10:36
ReplyDeleteprobably not the case here but certainly the type of thing that makes suicide bombers, and other easily lead persons.
Get a bunch of immature guys together and start daring them to misbehave and call them girly men if they don't, or failures to their faith - all sorts of bad things can happen
G, please update that they determined the guy was a cab driver getting change.
ReplyDeleteHe's been sheriff since 1980, pre-dating the idiots in power now. Arizona is kind of like Alaska - used to be a frontier-spirit, independent thinking kind of place, before all the developer trash arrived on the scene from California and Florida
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said...
ReplyDeleteSarah Palin's response to public objection of her violent rhetoric and crosshairs was dismissed and mocked by her. She responded by writing a FB post about the basketball play offs that was loaded with this language. Palin mocked and escalated her extreme use of words disregarding the violent acts and escalatio of threats made against congressman and senators. Palin continued to repeat her lie about death panels inciting hatred, terror and rage amongst people conned she is a christian hockey mom. Politicians like abusers use words as tools and weapons to manipulate people. Palin and ilk like her know what they are doing, deny their agenda and deny (lie) they are responsible. She just turns it around that she is the victim and projecting others are haters and the attackers when she is called out for her behavior, actions and words. Palin also gave her daughters a free pass for their hate filled speech, name calling and real personal verbal assaults on FB.
http://alaskawtf.blogspot.com/2011/01/palin-admits-guilt-in-arizona-murders.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+AlaskaWtf+%28Alaska+WTF%29
Anon 10:59 is 100% correct in his description of Tucson residence. -E
ReplyDeleteA must read.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.politicususa.com/en/sarah-palins-mass-murders-obscene-left
Our words are spoken because they convey meaning such as comfort, motivation, information, inspiration, entertainment, and influence. Paid speakers are not hired because they'll have no effect on their audience. Surely, we have free will and are responsible for our actions. The question then becomes, how much should others feel responsible? This is much harder to identify and quantify but doesn't mean it's not part of the picture.
ReplyDelete"Julian Assange says Sarah Palin, Fox News Inciting Murder" - Interview w/ Cenk Uygur (YouTube)
ReplyDeleteASSANGE: Well, let's look at the definition of terrorism. The definition of terrorism is a group that uses violence or the threat of violence for political ends.
So it's clear that whoever the terrorists are here, it's not us.
But we see constant threats from people in the Re -- you know, Republicans in the Senate trying to make a -- a name for themselves, the people like Sarah Palin, top shock jocks on Fox and, unfortunately, some members, also, of the Democratic Party, calling for my assassination, calling for the illegal kidnapping of my staff.
And -- and just a few days ago, it was in Fox, that was the phrase that was used -- illegal. He should be illegally murdered if necessary-- assassinated by the law, if possible, if not, illegally.
What sort of message does that send about the rule of law in the United States?
That is conducting violence in order to achieve a political end -- the elimination of this organization or the threat of violence to achieve a political end, the elimination of a publisher. And that is the definition of terrorism.
UYGUR: Now, I want to give you a chance to respond personally, though, because here Mike Huckabee is making it very personal. You saw that quote we had up. He says, I think anything less than execution is too kind a penalty for you. Sarah Palin is saying that you are like al Qaeda and the Taliban and he -- you should be pursued with the same urgency.
How do you respond to Sarah Palin, a top Republican leader who might run for president again?
ASSANGE: Oh, it's just another idiot trying to make a name for himself. But it's a -- it's a serious business. I mean if we are to have a civil society, you cannot have senior people making calls on national TV to go around the judiciary and illegally murder people.
That is incitement to commit murder. That is an offense. You cannot have senior people on national TV asking people to commit an offense.
That is not a country that obeys the rule of law. Does the United States obey the rule of law? Because Europeans are starting to wonder whether it is still obeying the rule of law?
And it needs to be very careful.
Is it going to descend into an anarchy where we don't have due process, where those great Bill of Rights traditions about due process are just thrown to the wind, when -- whenever some shock jock politician thinks that they can use it to make a name for themselves?
Or do we take things according to laws expressly made by the people and their representatives?
That is the way things should be done. And -- and when people call for illegal, deliberate assassination and kidnapping of others, they should be held to account. They should be charged for incitement to commit murder.
Sarah Palin blamed by the US Secret Service over death threats against Barack Obama
ReplyDeleteThe Telegraph, 08 Nov 2008
"The Republican vice presidential candidate attracted criticism for accusing Mr Obama of "palling around with terrorists", citing his association with the sixties radical William Ayers.
The attacks provoked a near lynch mob atmosphere at her rallies, with supporters yelling "terrorist" and "kill him" until the McCain campaign ordered her to tone down the rhetoric.
But it has now emerged that her demagogic tone may have unintentionally encouraged white supremacists to go even further.
The Secret Service warned the Obama family in mid October that they had seen a dramatic increase in the number of threats against the Democratic candidate, coinciding with Mrs Palin's attacks.
Michelle Obama, the future First Lady, was so upset that she turned to her friend and campaign adviser Valerie Jarrett and said: "Why would they try to make people hate us?"
Secret Service Connects Sarah Palin to Death Threat Increase Against President Obama
17 AUGUST 2010
"The United States Secret Service has just released information that shows a strong correlation between a rise in potential and actual death threats against the president and remarks made by Sarah Palin, John McCain’s former vice presidential running mate.
Palin's attacks on President Obama, including specific comments regarding his patriotism, led to an increase in threats against Obama during the last weeks of his presidential campaign, when Palin accused him of "palling around with terrorists."
The report, which was released by Stratfor Global Intelligence, an independent, non-ideological intelligence organization, said that Palin's dissentious and incendiary tone may have unwittingly emboldened white supremacists and other hate groups to plan attacks on Obama prior to his election. In fact, many on the 2008 campaign trail have asserted that her speeches often were replete with supporters yelling "kill" Obama as well as calling him a "terrorist." This is one reason that John McCain mandated that Palin reduce the contentiousness of her remarks regarding Obama."
"The investigation has been taken over by the FBI, and is being run through the Tucson Command Post. Here's what can be confirmed at this time (1800 hrs)... * Gabrielle Giffords Is in ICU.* Federal judge John Roll is deceased. He did rule on a 32 million dollar civil rights lawsuit in February, 2010. That ruling brought death threats to Roll and his family, and for a time he was given a protection detail.* 6 deaths attributed to the shooting. 19 total people hit by gunfire.* suspect’s mother works for the Pima County Board of Supervisors* the suspect has multiple arrests ... But no criminal record? Intervention by someone?* no direct connection - but strong suspicion is being directed at AmRen / American Renaissance. Suspect is possibly linked to this group. (through videos posted on his myspace and YouTube account.). The group’s ideology is anti government, anti immigration, anti ZOG (Zionist Occupational Government), anti Semitic. Gabrielle Gifford is the first Jewish female elected to such a high position in the US government. She was also opposite this group’s ideology when it came to immigration debate.* DHS have a list of names and dates of birth of all victims.* the ACTIC is still playing a major role in the investigation... Computer forensics is cleaning up the surveillance videos, and images from around the scene, and involved in the investigation - working together, was MCSO, DPS, Phoenix PD, ICE, and of course the FBI. It did just come in from the command post, that the federal judge was Not originally scheduled to attend the meeting, according to wife. She stated that he received a phone call about an hour before and was invited to attend. Wrong place - wrong time. For the planning side, there are impromptu memorials popping up all over the state, but the largest one is downtown phoenix, at the capital."
ReplyDeleteAnd here is where I do hold Sarah Palin accountable for her irresponsible, selfish and cynical behavior. Ms Palin has been aware of the consequences of her words for a long time now. Ms Palin used to give out public statements as a governor that called for a “backlash” against “asinine” citizens who filed ethics complaints against her. Ms Palin has seen the death threats her rabid, unstable “fans” have issued to anyone who dared to call Ms Palin accountable, including Senator Yee of California whose only crime was to ask the university where Ms Palin was speaking to disclose what it was paying her. For this, he received heinous death threats, faxes of a noose around his neck and President Obama’s neck, and ugly, vile disgusting rhetoric dripping with gutter hate only fit for the mentally unstable. But those are Ms Palin’s bestest fans.
ReplyDeleteAnd for those reasons, Ms Palin is well aware of the consequences of her actions. And yet, instead of having had a re-think, Ms Palin went to bed last night feeling like she was the victim here.
A nine year old girl is dead along with five other people—people with families, people who were someone’s world – and yet Ms Palin went to sleep last night feeling sorry for herself. This is where we have a disconnect that cannot pass.
http://www.politicususa.com/en/sarah-palins-mass-murders-obscene-left
You can tell that Sheriff Dupnik is speaking the truth because conservatives are lining up to condemn his words. These people have absolutely no shame whatsoever and are a cancer upon this country.
ReplyDeleteSarah Palin’s Alaska didn’t work out quite like either party thought it would. Palin thought the show would rehabilitate her image by making America forget 2008, and fall in love with her and her family. She hoped that America’s new found love would propel her to the White House in 2012. Things have not quite played out that way. The show has been an addictive train wreck. It was must see television just to check out how Sarah could humiliate herself each week. Instead of helping her look presidential, the show revealed her to be petty and bitter about 2008.
ReplyDeletePalin appeared just as hollow and uninformed as ever as she desperately tried to cling her image as All American Rugged Outdoors Woman. This image bit the dust as it was revealed that Palin can’t shoot. Palin also can’t fish, and she doesn’t seem to know much about the outdoors either. Sarah Palin’s Alaska tried to fool America into loving a person that is a figment of Sarah Palin’s own imagination. Goodbye, Sarah Palin’s Alaska.
http://www.politicususa.com/en/sarah-palins-alaska-season-2
11:43 "homosexual tendancies"??? I think I smell a troll...
ReplyDeletePoliticususa piece is excellent!
ReplyDeleteThanks for the link Anon 11:11
It brings to light a number of incidents we have forgotten - as there have been many to remember as she preached her ad nauseam soundbyte chants to, in her mind, the real Americans, the real Patriots - her attempt of dividing America.
http://www.politicususa.com/en/sarah-palins-mass-murders-obscene-left
We should remember too, the judge in AK that had to hire security while hearing the custody case of Tripp. This courtesy of her cult followers.
From" http://twitter.com/Bristol_Palin
ReplyDelete"You are a paid member of the "lame stream media" you're always referring to, mom. Fire all of your ghost writers and tweet for yourself :("
5 minutes ago via Twitter for Android
??????
Watching CNN last nite, there was an interview with a couple that had just parked their vehicle when the shooting began. They stated they saw an individual running away from the parking lot I believe in a white shirt and jeans. Their impression was that he was in a big hurry. In my mind I figured it was most probably a young man, maybe a friend that had accompanied the shooter. I wonder if the shooter wanted someone to witness him in action.
ReplyDeleteI haven't heard anything to date about this and wonder if anyone else had heard this report on CNN last nite.
I think it's somewhat karma that timing of Palin's paid political message aka her reality show, scripted in the hope to rehabilitate her image finishes on this weekend.
ReplyDeleteHow can the majority watch the show tonight without giving thought and remembering the tragedy of yesterday. We know it's been filmed for months and we will hear those soundbyte slogans of 'Don't retreat, just reload', etc. It re-enforces the discussion of her adnauseam violence rhetoric rants from the map to present day.
A friend today said to me she already sees in her mind if Palin ever did run, the ads which are writing themselves, depicting the crosshair map and the pics of the Rep Giffords and the others lost and the scene of the shootings.
The SPA show tonight, with yesterday's tragedy so fresh, might even sink into the braincells of the MSM about what everyone is saying about Palin.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/01/09/arizona.shooting.investigation/
ReplyDeleteYeah my money's on the anti-semitic angle.
You know, given that he's against the supposed "mind control" and similar radical notions, I'm a little shocked he's never targeted Sarah Palin. Aside from not being jewish, she seems to be his perfect target type
ReplyDelete@1245p: No shortage of trolls grasping at them bendy straws lately
ReplyDeleteWell, for Sheriff Dupnik, I am proud. He is the kind of Tucsonan who has worked tirelessly to uphold the rule of law, with discretion, mercy, and humanity.
ReplyDeleteThis is how I have known Tucsonans to be since I arrived here in 1969. This is the personality of Tucson and most of southern Arizona.
What has happened here (the ideology of people like Brewer, Palin, McCain, Kyl, et al) is what is happening around the country.
It is an epidemic. Now there are more casualties.
Sheriff Dupnik has a seniority from waaaaaay back. He's 75 years old and can say what he believes.
Please, when you think of Tucsonans, think of us as mostly like the Sheriff. He's right.
The people of Tombstone learned in the 19th century to prohibit guns within the city limits, and that's what caused the gunfight.
Seems the citizens of Tombstone in the 1800s, who were most familiar with guns and their usage, knew better than to invite trouble.
We need to wake up and reject hate speech and violence.
Anon 1:22
ReplyDeleteThat he was so much against 'mind control' may reveal the opposite in that being totally unbalanced, he's the perfect candidate and totally unaware of it.
His writings about the currency gold/silver and various other issues, where have those rants been heard. Beck and others and I recall some weasel speaking on the floor of the House about it (I can't remember who)
@Gles 1:10pm
ReplyDeleteTell me something. If you were in a crowd of people and shots were fired, wouldn't you run away? Good grief.
Of COURSE Mansour and Tammy Bruce are defending the indefensible (visa vi Palin and her target map), look what the Teabagging nation has to say!!:
ReplyDeleteShowing no sign of tamping down on divisive political rhetoric in the wake of the shooting of 20 people that left six dead in Tuscon Saturday, the Tea Party Nation group e-mailed its members Sunday warning them they would be called upon to fight leftists in the days ahead and defend their movement.
TPN founder Judson Phillips, in an article linked off the e-mail "The shooting of Gabrielle Giffords and the left's attack on the Tea Party movement," described the shooter as "a leftist lunatic" and Pima County Sheriff Clarence Dupnik as a "leftist sheriff" who "was one of the first to start in on the liberal attack."
Phillips urged tea party supporters to blame liberals for the attack on centrist Democratic Rep. Gabrielle Giffords of Arizona, who was shot through the head and is now fighting for her life, as a means of defending the tea party movement's recent electoral gains.
The Atlantic http://t.co/xSKKCvr
They are a dangerous, despicable bunch!!
Anon 1:10...if I was in the vicinity when some nutcase started shooting indiscrimately, I'd run as fast as I could in the other direction too.
ReplyDeleteHey Gryphen--check the spelling--in your last part of this post it says Laughner instead of the correct Loughner. There was a fake facebook page posted on the internet under the name Jared Laughner creating disinformation which nobody needs right now...
ReplyDeleteGryphen wrote: "I have no idea how this sheriff managed to be elected in a place that has Jan Brewer as it's governor and John McCain representing it in the Senate, but Arizona should be proud to have him."
ReplyDeleteThere are at least two different Arizonas-Phoenix, and everywhere else. The majority of the people live in Phoenix, so most of the political decisions are made there. Pima county and Coconino county, up around Flagstaff, are the most liberal parts of the state. For example our new medical marijuana law failed in all but two counties in the last election. The margin of yes votes in Pima and Coconino county put it over the top. Grandstanding Sheriff Joe is very popular in the Phoenix area. In the rest of the state he's widely regarded as a bad joke. And so it goes.
Just as reasonable people don't judge Alaskans by the sorry state of the of the political reality there, you should also consider a broader view of Arizona.
This is not such a big thing Gryphen. It's just gun play in the land of the gun and it's what Americans have chosen to accept as normal. People's children get slaughtered every day in every state because of their choices. Get the fuck over it, you're a murican and a few kids are worth yer secund mendmunt rights.
ReplyDelete@Anonymous Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteBAustin - good point
Where's Brewer.
Where is any one from Arizona except the one sheriff?
11:37 AM
****************
This is federal now. Keep up!
AND
4:40, how are things in the Hawiyah?
Sheriff Dupnik is a class act. He has strongly opposed SB1070 during last years heated and hateful passing of this law. He is the Sheriff of Pima County, where Tucson is located. We are for the most part a blue county and will hopefully continue to elect him into office. I am proud of him for standing up and speaking out against the people who are spewing the hate.
ReplyDeleteYOU ARE ALL WRONG !
ReplyDeleteThere is no mental instability ! Hitler wasn't insane ! He was extremly GREEDY and EVIL ! Think just a litle: People who are good to their bones, are they insane ? Mentaly inbalanced ? Of course not ! We the 2 legged animals (all my respect to those handful deccent ones who still between us)the rest can't be trusted totaly. The 2 legged animal is the MOST EVIL an our planet ! They proved that for 1000's of years for their CRUELTY ! I do NOT understand why,gladly I couldn't hurt anyone EXCEPT "if my family is in danger my 4 legged kids included, my self included" !! Other wise why do harm to anyone including animal world ! Be very WATCHFUL for people or kids who mistreat poor defensless pats and other animals :
Is well established and DOCUMENTED that ALL murderers started with poor defensles animals ! Lots of hunters are in the murderes group ! This is also well known ! We do NOT have to live in fear ! We just have to be aware ALWAYS about our suroundings at ALL times ! We have NO garantees, but less danger ! NEVER walk ALONE in parks and similar area whre this dirt bags could jum us :O( Since age 3 my parents tought me to be careful !It helped until now, who knows about the future ! But I am keeping my finger crosed ! My deepest symapthy to those peoples families who did lost loved ones and those who struggle to stay alive ! :O( For you all I wish long life and SAFETY ! Sad that we have to live like this ! :O(