So, my fellow moderates, now it is time for us to acquaint ourselves with our very own homegrown version of radical Christian fundamentalists. Do not confuse them with the majority of Christians in America who are mainline Christians. Mainline Christians are those who actually follow the teachings of Christ that promote kindness, compassion and love thy neighbor; don’t judge lest ye be judged; let them know you by your good deeds; and it will be easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man to enter the Kingdom of Heaven. THOSE Christians.
Christian Dominionists on the other hand believe that we are in the End Times and that they must proactively make the way for the 2nd coming of Christ. They ignore passages from the Bible written that Jesus said “you will not know the day, the hour…I will come like a thief in the night”. Instead they have a laundry list of duties that they must implement before Christ can return. Some of these include fulfilling the Great Commission (Matthew 28: 16-20 ) which they interpret to mean that they are to go forth and aggressively hound the people of the world into conversion, “harvesting as many souls” as possible. (Their words not mine).
Additionally, they are to prepare Israel for the return of all the Jews from around the globe – hence their pro-Israel rhetoric and schizophrenic “love the country – not the Jew” policies. (We have all witnessed how they apply that, the “love the sinner – not the sin” when they try to mask their homophobia). So, in order to have room for all these Jews who they see making their way to Israel soon, as was pointed out by Sarah Palin, there is no land to spare! Palestine just doesn’t fit into this plan, so negotiating a two-State solution is just out of the question.
It makes no difference that they discriminate horribly against the Jews otherwise, calling them “Jesus-killer”, “anti-Christian”, “the Yiddish are coming!”, and a plethora of hate-filled name-calling all in the name of God. Remember, they love the country – they are just not so fond of the inhabitants
Among the current Republicans running for President almost ALL of them are, either embracing dominionist views, or are full blown dominionists themselves.
These include Rick Perry, Tim Pawlenty, Michele Bachmann, Rick Santorum, Herman Cain, and Newt Gingrich (Though I really think Newt is faking it.)
Sarah Palin, who has not yet declared and probably never will, is DEFINITELY a dominionist! In fact that may be the ONLY authentic thing about her.
I would suggest that Mitt Romeny, Jon Huntsman, and Ron Paul do NOT embrace the dominionist beliefs, which is why ultimately it will be VERY difficult for either of them to get the Evangelical support they desperately need in order to have any chance in the general election. (McCain overcame that obstacle by plucking Sarah Palin out of the wilds of Wasilla and unleashing her like a pestilence throughout the rest of America.)
By the way Leah Burton is my go to expert on all things dominionist or fundamentalist in nature. She is one of the most well respected experts in the country and we have had several long and fascinating discussions on numerous topics in the past. To learn more about her work, I suggest that you visit her site God's Own Party.
Isn't it interesting that this term is never brought up in interviews with these folks? Obama has been asked every which way from Sunday if he is a Christian or not, but these GOP religious conservatives are never asked to elaborate on their own affiliations and practices.
ReplyDeleteMitt and Huntsman are Mormon, and as such I doubt they have anything to do with this belief set (which is highly specific).
I would like one journalist to flat out ask one of the GOP candidates about their being Dominionists. Just break the ice on it and see how they react.
I think it is important to point out that there are most definitely non-Dominionist Evangelicals. They are not one and the same. It's possible some Evangelical voters would very much embrace a Christian conservative who does not happen to be a Dominionist. They wouldn't be concerned about that agenda, in particular.
It looks like there is a distinction between "soft Dominionism" or Christian Nationalism, and "hard Dominionism", which is the more literal, extreme viewpoint.
I would suspect that if the GOP candidates you mention are in fact Dominionists, they are of the first variety. We probably cannot group all these people together.
Some time ago, I remember seeing (I think on this blog) a link to a Dominionist web site discussing End of Days.
ReplyDeleteAccording to this site, as the End of Days approached we would see newborn babies appearing in households where the "mother" had not been pregnant.
Did anyone else see or remember the link or the web site?
The presidential candidate who comes up with the platform "END all tax breaks and exemptions to every religious institution immediately", gets my vote!
ReplyDeleteI am HIGHLY suspicious of Palin and can not believe that she is truly religious. I think it is an act to fool the donors. Maybe to fool Franklin Graham, so she can learn about how he fools people into donating to his lavish lifestyle. Maybe her next gig will be as a televangelist, although with a divorce and all the baggage from her dysfunctional family that might not be easy.
ReplyDeleteWhen I was in First Grade, the Nuns explained to us that we shouldn't hate the Jews for crucifying Jesus because they were doing what was predestined by God, and without the Crucifixion Jesus could not have died for our sins.
ReplyDeleteMind you, in First Grade I didn't know we were SUPPOSED to hate the Jews - or anyone else - and in any case I took them at their word. I'm not much of a Catholic anymore, although I do wear a Miraculous Medal just in case I die on the street and someone thinks to give me last rites. No need to tempt Fate, right? ;)
I have never understood the "crhistian" hatred of the Jews by for the Crucifixion. It's an oxymoron.
These people are determined to foist this atrocity on our country. They will lie, obfuscate, rig elections, etc. BIG money seems to be behind them for some reason - surely NOT because the BIG money players have any religion other than money.
ReplyDeleteCitizens United was a Dominionist victory... they are NOT to be dismissed as just whackos, they have POWER. Most people never heard of Dominionism.
Leah Burton has my utmost admiration.
ReplyDeleteSeparation of Church and State could very easily be maintained if only the ONE actual piece of ground/building of worship (church, synagogue, mosque, temple)were to be tax exempt, but no other holdings.
Propose that one and listen to them squeal!
Not happening.
Romney and Huntsman are Mormons, which is anathema to evangelical Christians. I don't think most evangelical Christians/dominionists would ever consider voting for a Mormon. I would imagine if either Romney or Huntsman receives the GOP nomination, he will find himself in a similar situation as McCain allegedly did--held hostage by the dominionists, forced to choose a radical like Bachmann to woo the dominionist vote.
ReplyDeleteHa, all knocked up before marriage. What a bunch of sluts.
ReplyDeleteDoes Track know Curtis is his daddy?
http://palingates.blogspot.com/2010/01/track-palin-and-curtis-menard-jr-new.html
Somewhere in Emails' a reader shown that Trig if born on April 18 and was Sarah's was not Todd's since he was on the slope. Are those linked some place?
Loving Dunn's book being labled already a blockbuster.
http://www.nationalenquirer.com/celebrity/sarah-palin-pregnancy-secrets
Newt mus be faking it. He converted to Catholicism, and Catholic theology teaches that the book of Revelation describes events which took place in the past, with Nero being the Anti-Christ. The "end times are upon us" and the fairly recent invention of rapture mythology are the purview of fundamentalists. They used to be fringe beliefs, and they need to stay that way.
ReplyDeleteAre Jews okay with Dominionist's plans for them? Frogs in a pot, anyone?
ReplyDeleteI am not so sure about Rand Paul.
ReplyDeleteJust a while ago, he claimed that we would not need any laws if everyone in this country is a Christian. Also he is extremely anti-choice.
4:08, I'll second that but it ain't gonna' happen. Religion is the opiate of the masses. Without religion, can't control people.
ReplyDeleteI agree with 4:44 (it's a sign!) - Sarah Palin fakes her Christianity. She may have attended some sort of evangelical place of worship in her past and thought it was "cool", but she's not a believer. I think her Christian-rightness is a fabrication, similar to her oil & gas expertise.
ReplyDeleteNot being snarky, but are people with NPD capable of worshiping a god?
Leah does an amazing job on her blog.
ReplyDeleteThe thing with these "dominionist" sects that bothers me most is how they've managed to engrain their message and overtake "Christianity" in much the same way as "Muslim Radicals" have done with Islam.
The sad thing is, real christians don't know enough about dominioinists teachings, they only see what they want to see, Christians following the teachings of the Bible.
I also remember the domininist site mentioned upthread. It was my first "Wake up call" when researching why Palin once said, paraphrasing here, "Israel's importance cannot be understimated, we must support Israel because there will be an influx of Israelites going back to their country in the days, weeks, months ahead"
Can someone explain to me on what basis, exactly, Churches are tax exempt? They're the second oldest professsion, and the first, in most places, isn't taxed as well.
From my amateur perspective on it, I think dominionists (laity) don't really call themselves that, they don't go into church services with this secret agenda on their minds or really know what it is. I think certain of the clergy from these denominations to watch for work behind the scenes - like a network with other big ministries. I think the members are unaware - don't really know that there's a secondary agenda besides the bible. I don't think they comprehend that the preaching they receive has a double meaning, where they are encouraged to spread the gospel by constraint to get themselves wormed into government, education, etc. If some do know, it would create a moral dilemna for them I'm sure, since they know that scripture teaches that they share in love it's up to an individual to choose and they'd be torn between the verse that says Jesus did not come to build His Kingdom on earth.
ReplyDeleteAwesome that Leah is on my favorite news site PoliiticusUSA. btw, you are my favorite blogger, Gryphen:-) Those are my two must reads every day.
ReplyDeleteThese crazy religious freaks scare me to death. Agree with anonymous 4:01 no msm every asks these people about their beliefs and why???
Sarah Jones bringing Leah on her site can't be very comforting for you know who. I'll bet if those two get talking things will get interesting.
Pass the popcorn!
That picture you posted looks alot like the one we had here in Denver when Mel Gibson did his religious movie that all the fundies were gaga over. If it is, that Pentecostal church was called, Loving way United Pentecostal Church. That sign caused a real stir as I recall. Coach Bill McCartney actually protested against the sign on the site of the church.
ReplyDeleteWhat is so frightening about fundies, is, they believe they have all of God's truth. Nothing is a mystery. The world was created in six actual 24 hour days, because it says so in Genesis, and the Rapture is supposed to happen due to a couple of obscure, nebulous scripture passages found in the Pauline Epistles, and how they interpret Revelation. The ironic thing is, that in Revelation it says that nothing should be added or taken away from this book. So we have Jenkins with his Left Behind series of books, adding all kinds of stuff to Revelation, go figure...The people who buy into this are completely brain washed. I belonged to this kind of thinking and church for many years. Didn't know there was any other way to believe. Then the internet happened, and I've learned that there's more then one way to skin a Theological cat. Their preachers all go to some Bible school that often times is a mail order operation, and get certified, ordained, sanforized,and brain washed, and then they go start a bible study in their basement, and get a bunch of others brainwashed as well in their interpretation of scripture. It used to be prevalent in the Bible Belt, but it's spread everywhere across the US. As a kid, I used to see brush arbors, and tent revivals while traveling through the Ozarks of MO. When I was in AK, I saw a tent revival right off the Highway there around Wasilla. So it's everywhere, and when people refuse to be critical thinkers, or are scared to death of spending eternity in Hell, you get this sort of thing.
The rich guys are loving it. It's the old divide and have all the working class folks fighting and fussing with each other, and then they can get their lackeys in power to destroy medicare, social security, national healthcare etc. They're good at it. Think of how it was in the South before civil rights, and that's what they want to go back too. Religion was a way of doing it in the fifties and sixties in the south, and looks like it's deja vu all over again. The only religion they have, is worshipping the almighty dollar.
Anon 4:01 - "I think it is important to point out that there are most definitely non-Dominionist Evangelicals."
ReplyDeleteThank you. This is very important. I suspect only a minority of Evangelicals would be considered true Dominionists. And I'm not at all convinced that Dominionists as a group hate Jews. It's easy to confuse the fundamentalist belief that one must be 'born again' to be 'saved' with hate but it simply isn't the same thing.
Wow!! For some reason this is on other minds as well!!
ReplyDeletePlease check out Politicususa - an article by H. Haraldsson entitled "
Christian Militants Merge With GOP Politics . . .
Pat Padrnos
6:08 p.m., from my (far more extensive than I would prefer) experience, dominionism is often taught from the pulpit, in so-called Christian schools, and in publications such as World magazine. I don't know what the dominionists call it--I don't think they use the term "dominionism"--but they are flagrant in presenting their political aims as an integral part of Christian teaching. I would agree that most congregation members don't think of dominionism as a secondary agenda, but that isn't necessarily out of ignorance--it's also because the political aspects are simply presented as part of Christian beliefs and the Christian "agenda".
ReplyDeleteI think there are also many people who don't know the extent and insanity of dominionist views but support organizations such as Samaritan's Purse out of a misguided desire to help others.
I grew up with Calvinist dominionism, and Calvinists tend not to believe in the Rapture, so I'm intrigued by the recent marriage between dominionism and Rapture theology. Leah Burton is indeed very knowledgeable about this, and is doing important work in spreading the word about this strain of so-called Christianity. I've spoken with Leah about my own experiences growing up in Dominionism, so although I usually post under a handle here at IM, I'm going to stay anonymous this time.
My real concern is the "trinity" comprised of the big money (Koch/Halliburton) the teaparty followers, and the religious right.
ReplyDeleteIt's now got the point that to be accepted as a true conservative, it's not enough to want rational fiscal restraint with civic consciousness, and life, liberty, and happiness.
The trinity I refer to above are DEMANDING that you toe the line, and believe EXACTLY what they preach about abortion, G_d, guns, gays, religion, and every other social or civic issue. Otherwise, you are a RINO and can't claim the title " conservative"
This is what it's coming to in America: The Christian Supremacists would amend the constitution and enshrine their own specific religious biblical viewpoint into law, in spite of the 1st Amendment..
That's their agenda, to infiltrate every aspect of government, law, education, media, and the courts
If you want an example of what it would be like living in a future "Christian States of America", read up on how badly the early Mormons treated anyone in Utah that didn't conform to their religious doctrines.
I think the interest in bible prophecy regarding the last days really got popular and everyone took an interest in it around the early 70's with Hal Lindsay's "The Great Late Planet Earth". In it, he outlined the prophecies in Revelation, Book of Daniel, and the minor prophets and tried to interpret where these occurrances in the world might be, like for instance, the bible refers to Cush, which is today's Ethiopia. Meshech, which some interpret as being Moscow. It speaks of the Roman Empire and how the Roman Empire will reemerge again in the end days (they feel the European Union is that re-emergence from ancient Roman Empire. Syria, Lebanon, Turkey, Valley of Megiddo, Egypt, even the rivers in Iraq which exist today (am having a senior moment can't remember, but they were referred to during the Persian Gulf War), a revived Babylon etc. so many I can't recall but all these were mentioned in the bible. Some of these are supposed to work with or against Israel in the last days. Too complicated to write here. But to summarize, if one is to believe that, everything centers around Israel, as it is the place where the New Jerusalem will dwell, a thousand years after there is peace first, on earth. New Jerusalem will not only be for jews, but gentiles, all included. I think a small portion of evangelicals take this and turn it into a doctrine. They shouldn't do that. They interpret it and think they must help God usher it in. Hal Lindsay wrote out a possible scenario of what he interpreted it could possibly be.
ReplyDeleteIt's dangerous to take it out of context and play war games with it. No one should ever do that. Jesus said He came to save men from their sins, all men. Christians can't and shouldn't think they can elevate a man or woman as their leader to impose or stick their noses into the business of Israel. In a humanitarian sense yes, but biblically speaking, God made his promise to Israel, and spiritual jews will decide how they maintain that relationship with God - it's not up to gentiles or the church to interfere and tell them what and what not to do. The spiritual business of Israel is between them and God. A real christian does not want to see a world in chaos. The only thing they are supposed to be entrusted with is their testimony and share it to others if others want to hear.
"from the diagonal" I would disagree with your taxing idea. For most churches, the main building and property is pretty straight forward, but when you get to these huge campuses with schools, tv studios, and I don't know what all, it becomes a lot more difficult. The church I attend used to have a school in the same building; its all one contiguous building. Experience would indicate if such a law were passed, the little guys would be honest and get hurt and the big guys would get expensive lawyers. So I say: tax them all according to the value of the land and buildings. The only exception I would make would be buildings on the National Historical Registry.
ReplyDeleteAnon. 6:57 - great points and it's so interesting to hear your experiences. Mine goes to pentecostal roots. Good people and mostly I attended small churches whose goals was just to minister. However, it's been a while since I've been in a church, needed to take a serious furlough. Then around and during the 2008 election, I tried to understand why some are deceived and fixed on politics. I didn't realize how far-reaching the dominionist thing seems to be going. I know that I can't read any christian sites anymore. Ones that I used to depend on and draw strength from are now all sounding like lemmings, bring up pro-life, anti-gay stances like they are on a warpath, and the anti-Obama, pro-Fox, pro-tea-party, pro-guns, pro-anything republican chants etc. that's when I realized they've really been sent a strong delusion. They insert "things of this world" (like guns) into spiritual entitlements. All I hear is "my rights, my entitlements". It's a me-me-me, God bless me, God prosper me, God give me-me-me spirit.
ReplyDeleteHope that this is just a small faction and that the majority don't fall for it. Just keep getting the word out and hoping more will speak out. I'm one of those the cup is half full people and am giving them the benefit of the doubt that they'll be wise to this crazy trend.
Curiouser - thanks for thanking me ;-). I do feel it's easy to become completely unstrung on this topic, for some. I feel there can be vast over-generalizations which just aren't terribly helpful, much less accurate.
ReplyDeleteThe idea that there is a conspiracy on the part of some church clergy to have Dominionist congregations WITHOUT the knowledge of the congregants seems bizarre. How would that even work? Wouldn't you think they would want people's conscious participation?
I am a mainline Christian (thanks for clarification in the post, Gryphen), and we absolutely do not harbor hostility towards Jews, historic or present era, nor do we harbor ill will towards anyone. We do not go around trying to collect souls for Jesus, none of that stuff. We simply try to live the Word, which is not easy to do, God knows (especially when it comes to all things Palin)!
The stuff about Catholics or Evangelicals hating Jews, again some of that is generational, and some of that is more abstract than one might think. There is this effort to reconcile the biblical events in a literal way, and it's just not possible. Obviously some of the Bible is based on history, some is symbolic literature. It's a mish mosh, as I like to say!
There is just so much grey area here, the topic is far more complex than we give it credit for being.
I do not think all of these GOP candidates are Dominionist. I think they are Christian conservatives. I do not think Evangelicals would refuse to vote for a Mormon. If anything, I would imagine a person like Mitt Romney would be quite appealing to them.
Some people sit out elections when they can't vote for their perfect candidate. Some people vote for what they consider to be the lesser of two evils. I see this country behaving as it always has, split pretty much down the middle. Conservative Christians will likely go for the GOP candidate, and if they are Christian - of any sort - so much the better.
Anon @ 7:50
ReplyDeleteJust addressing one small part of your interesting post--Catholics revere Judaism and incorporate some tenets of that faith in our practices. For example, recently it was decided that the name of God, the Tetragrammaton YHWH, should not be pronounced even in our hymnals, in keeping with Jewish belief. Now we substitute Lord or Adonai. We observe the day's end at sunset, as Jews do. And when my husband converted, he and the other newly confirmed wore a traditional Jewish tallit (prayer shawl).
Perhaps before my time there was some antipathy as you refer to, but I see nothing like that in my church today.
Sarah Palin's religion is the Almighty $$$$!!! She doesn't actually give a crap about Christianity or God, she's really just your basic every day whore!!
ReplyDeleteI was raised Mormon. You may not realise it, but Mormons embrace a Dominionist theology. Humtsman is distancing himself from Mormonism, but Romney is not.
ReplyDeleteRick Santorum is a Catholic. What kind of Catholic, I don't know or recognize.
ReplyDeleteWhile he may be in the Presidential race, he's not really running. It's a ruse to garner a greater name recognizition, & to earn higher speaking fees & perhaps land a better job.
Santorum is a liar, a thief & an opportunist.
If it makes anyone feel better, we aren't the only ones who think the Wicked Bitch from Wasilla is not playing with a full deck.
ReplyDeleteI happen to work at a VERY famous restaurant, owned by a VERY famous chef, on a VERY famous street, that had a VERY famous guest this past weekend.
Lets just say that its amazing what people will say when they consider you invisible... And someone with a LOT of clout in the RNC had a rather interesting opinion about a certain quitter...
But since I don't want to end up like WendyWaitress, I hesitate to share details. Those flying monkeys are vicious and I wouldn't put it past them to try to cost me my job.
Um, Griff?
Wanna chat?
If you think this country is not in trouble, you'd better think again:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.religiousrightwatch.com/2010/02/whats-happened-to-americas-scientific-greatness.html
Of course, some of this might be attributable to popular culture and the general inclination for millions of Americans wanting to be entertained and pleasured to their graves, but if education is being skewed in favor of the Dominionists, that is far worse because religion is always a much more sustainable influence in people's lives.
Thanks Jude. It's good when people post here with realtime reports on mainstream religious adherents' practice. That is very interesting. When I said abstract I think I was trying to say that there can be an historic interpretation of biblical events, but that doesn't necessarily translate into any active antipathy in current daily life.
ReplyDeleteOur church does not "lay blame" in any way regarding Jesus's death, as it was the fulfillment of his destiny and we are talking about a particular historical context.
We also do not believe we can facilitate a Second Coming. Not up to us, in the slightest.
As I said earlier, just following the teachings of Jesus should be enough for any Christian. It's supremely difficult, actually. I fail on a regular basis!
For me the GOP way has always been in contradiction to Christian belief, I don't care what these candidates say. Their platform has traditionally been so lacking in compassion and mostly focused on allowing the rich to keep their riches. That for sure is not a Christian value at all.
5:41 That quote about all the Jews returning to Israel is from the Oprah interview. It should be highlighted because she gave herself away.
ReplyDeleteJust one more example of the Spiral of Silence that surrounds these people.
Griffin you should highlight this quote and ask the question of why SP told Oprah that all the Jews will be returning to Israel soon. It's a scary thought and the voters need to understand. Why isn't the MSM asking other Cons about this?