Jeb Bush, Marco Rubio, Bobby Jindal, Rick Santorum and Ben Carson are rushing to defend Indiana's "religious freedom" law, standing with social conservatives on a measure that opponents have said opens the door to discrimination against gays and lesbians.
Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker, meanwhile, is backing the "principle" of the measure.
The likely Republican contenders for their party's 2016 presidential nomination supported the law the day after Indiana Gov. Mike Pence struggled to explain it in an appearance on ABC's "This Week."
"Gov. Pence has done the right thing," Bush, the former Florida governor, told conservative radio host Hugh Hewitt on Monday evening.
"This is simply allowing people of faith space to be able to express their beliefs -- to be able to be people of conscience," Bush said. "I think once the facts are established, people aren't going to see this as discriminatory at all."
Actually in the last several days we have all learned quite a bit about the "facts" and they have only reinforced that this law is going to be used to discriminate against gay people.
A fact driven home during the Governor Pence interview with George Stephanopoulos where he was repeatedly given the opportunity to say that the law would NOT discriminate against gays, and flat out refused to do so.
And let's not forget that it was only in 2004 when the Republicans, including Jeb's brother, were pushing pretty hard to pass the Federal Marriage Amendment, that would have outlawed gay marriage completely.
Even still I find it almost impossible to believe that ANY conservative politician seeking national office in 2016 would allow their name to be associated with this Indiana law in any way.
But hey it's their political funeral.
Indiana Gov. Mike Pence (TEA-BIGOT): "If I saw a restaurant owner refuse to serve a gay couple, I wouldn’t eat there anymore."
ReplyDelete/s "And if I saw an EMT refuse to defibrillate a gay man suffering a heart attack then I wouldn't use that ambulance service again." :-)
Sorry, Governor. You signed it; you own it.
Nicely put.
DeleteHe can sit back on his so-called principals as his state continues to lose money and jobs when more and more big companies refuse to do business in Indiana.
DeleteHere is the biggest question: how do they KNOW people are gay? How do they know people are bi-sexual? How do they know people are transgendered? How do they know who has, and who has not, had a sex change surgery? No, seriously. Not all people who 'look' gay ARE gay, and not all people who 'look' straight ARE straight. And what if only one-half of the 'gay' couple calls or walks into the bakery asking for the wedding cake to be made, and the bakery never knows the difference? I believe the amount of self-projection involved in drafting this law is so huge we could drive a semi right through it.
DeleteTo paraphrase their excuse/defense, that this law is based solely on 'behavior' and not on status (i.e., because 'gaydom' is a choice, according to them), then I would like to respond as follows. I find the chosen behaviors of adultery, pedophilia, incest, child abuse, spousal abuse, bullying, incitement to violence, lying, bigotry, and divorce to be detestable behavior choices. I think the Bible backs me up on all of these beliefs. Therefore, if I am gay and own a restaurant, according to Pence and under Indiana's law, why can't I exclude all the people who I 'believe' are guilty of these detestable acts/behaviors?
There is a reason why Jesus taught us that 'let him who is without sin cast the first stone'. Pence, et al, violate not only this commandment, but the following one laid down by the Apostle Paul in 1 Corinthians 5:12: "What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those INSIDE?" Paul, in the preceding verses, commanded his followers to "expel the wicked brother among YOU!" Pence, et al, show that they are dead-set against following the orders of either Jesus or Paul, and that, thus, they are followers of neither. The world 'gets this': the world can always spot a hypocrite.
Pence, et al, have also exposed the moral silliness of their position – and the real reason for their legislation. After all, why just single out homosexuality as the only sin worth discussing and acting against, if you are truly a 'God-fearing' society???? I can tell you why: because it TOTALLY CHANGES THE SUBJECT away from any discussion of a pedophile priesthood, THAT'S why. If you don't believe me, I have a bridge to sell you in Brooklyn.
It struck me as borderline comical to see Pence's signing ceremony photo for this law, where he flanked on all sides by nuns – many/most of whom are lesbians, and all of whom support a pedophile priesthood. Why isn't everyone shouting THAT from the rooftops??? I'll tell you why: it's because the entire 'gay agenda' is a straw-man argument precisely tailored to change the subject, and on a daily basis proves that it IS superbly successful at doing just that (changing the subject away from any discussion about the pedophile priesthood).
Why do progressives always react instead of setting their own agenda? Why doesn't the left start determining what the talking points will be, instead of always responding to right-wing silliness and moral depravity????? Bill Clinton was a brilliant agenda-setter, and I can't think of anyone on his level that the dems have trotted out since. I hope Hillary will be just as talented as Bill in this regard.
Not to mention "use that ambulance service agian?" - meanwhile, the gay person is dead and not likely to be using ANY servce again. Pence is an ass.
DeleteWant to hear what is worse? Indiana has a vouche rlaw. THey take tax dollars and use it to send kids to the "school of the parent's choic" eeven (or especially) if that is a religious school. My religion is against organized religion seeing it as harmful to kids and to our future country, yet Pence is infringing on MY BELIEFS to use my tax dollars for something that I find morally objectionable.
DeleteAND 11:28 you are very ignorant about most "nuns" in the RCC.
DeleteThese idiots have NO idea what they are doing.... The Cannabis Church has sprung up in the "hoozier" state! Now I think that's a good thing but some may not. But hey! Its religious freedom! I'm sure more fuckup from this dumbassed leg will crop up and it won't be to their liking, nope. And its still against the law to discriminate against race, creed or sex....soooo? What are they accomplishing?
Delete"Even still I find it almost impossible to believe that ANY conservative politician seeking national office in 2016 would allow their name to be associated with this Indiana law in any way."
ReplyDeleteBelieve it and be glad for it -- one more reason to encourage progressive to vote!
I just saw another state is doing it also...but its going to bite them in the ass all of 'em any of them...because these people are trying to justify a way to discriminate using religion and its illegal. But Hobbylobby opened the door to this shit. Argh!!! Even tho quite a few SCOTUS is secretly gay!
DeleteBush says "people of conscience"???? Excuse me, these people have no conscience, and nor, obviously, does he.
ReplyDeleteAs someone commented on a related politicususa article, by the nature of this law, wouldn't an atheist business owner then be allowed to post a sign "No Christians Allowed?" Try THAT and watch the uproar!
ReplyDeleteI have been told by Christians who support "religious freedom" laws that they would be perfectly fine with that because they don't want to give those places their business anyway. I suspect that attitude would last only until all their favorite stores post those signs. Then again, they're the type who buy Duck Dynasty gear at Wal-mart, so they might not have to worry.
DeleteWalmart isn't excatly supportive of this law.
Deletesurprise, knock me over with a feather, but checkout NASCAR's take on this recent legislation >>> http://www.nascar.com/en_us/news-media/articles/2015/3/31/nascar-statement-on-indiana-legislation.html
ReplyDeletethis pic of jeb makes him look a lot like his pretzel choking, cod piece wearing, alcoholic criminal big brother - what the hell, just about the entire bush clan are criminals ..
Wow, good for them. Thanks for the link
Deleteactually NASCAR's take really houldn't surprise me since their inception of the Drive for Diversity campaign was instituted a few years back, welcoming any race, nationality or gender, kudos to NASCAR ...
DeleteThe most successful of the recent bunch would be Darryl Wallace, he's doing extremely well ! Great roll model too !!
True Christians know that ALL sins are equal in the eyes of God. If, they are true to their convictions, they would deny service to adulterers, murderers, greedy people, drunkards, revilers, etc. By only hating on gays, they are not practicing "Religious Freedom", they are just Bigots, blaming God for their hate.
ReplyDeleteRight on. Should rename the law the Bigotry Restoration Act.
DeleteI agree, but I've had Christians tell me that homosexuality is worse than other sins. My favorite response, when I asked a blogger why she held this position, was "I can't remember, but I know it is. I'll have to ask my pastor why again."
DeleteMy dad says that because God created man and woman, homosexuality is the deepest form of defiance against God that anyone can commit. (He also believes being gay is a choice.) I'm not sure he's ever interacted with anyone he knew was gay; I know that he has never had a conversation with anyone in the LGBTQ community about their sexual orientation and what kind of discrimination they experience.
The most ridiculous conversation we ever had about homosexuality: He went on some Rush Limbaugh-inspired tear about "the gay agenda"; I said, "Some of my closest friends are gay men, and their only agenda is the same one everyone has, to lead their lives and be happy." His response: "Of course they don't tell you; they don't want people to know what their agenda is" [which I guess is why someone let Rush Limbaugh in on the secret??]. Me: "If they had a Gay Agenda, they would have no reason not to tell me, because they know I would support it." Him: "Fine, they're out of touch with the other 95% of the homosexual movement." You can't even reason with that level of delusional absurdity.
If Rush Limbaugh is telling folks like your father there's a "gay agenda", how would Rush Limbaugh know, since "they don't want people to know what their agenda is"?
DeleteDoes it ever occur to people who believe there's a "gay agenda", that Rush Limbaugh might be an insider, privy to the secrets of the "gay agenda" -- thus someone these bigots would shun?
RW "logic" -- it defies critical thinking. It defies what separates us from the beasts of the field.
10:47:
DeleteThank you for being a friend.....
Anonymous 10:47, does your dad believe that God created children?
DeleteIf so, how could sexual and physical abuse crimes against them NOT be extremely high on God's agenda of hateful things? With respect to child abuse of all kinds, this was the only sin about which Jesus said, "It would be better for such a man if he had merely tied a millstone around his neck and drowned (Matthew 18:6)." That is a powerful statement.
Why did Pence not pass a law allowing Indianans to discriminate against Pedophiles? When you know that Pence's law is backed by the Catholic church (see bill-signing photo), which allows for a pedophile priesthood (and by perhaps/presumably closeted men who hope to make money off of 'reparative gay therapy'), then you will know the answer.
12:52 AM. Like the fundies, they never moved out of the Old Testament. "Spare the rod, spoil the child" and the like.
DeleteWhoa there 12:52. First, Pope Francis, Second, the hierarchy (and all the hierarchy are not in lockstep) is not the peopel of the RCC. Much of the RCC is about Social Justice. Pence and his cronies are teh teavangelist types. They only use the churhc and the token rabii in that photo. Given them time, if theyonce established their theocracy, they'd quickly use this law to say no Jews or Catholics.
DeleteIt literally brings tears to my eyes knowing how many have stood up to this latest "God says it's just fine to hate fags" garbage legislation clearly authored to counter the upcoming gay marriage decision looming in SCOTUS. This is exactly what they want, to be seen as victims of religious persecution, basically for donations. These grifters suck the bible thumping paint chip eaters dry..I am so sick of these asshats using God as an excuse to hate, and these conartists are no better than ISIS....the support against this bill has restored my faith in humankind, somewhat.
ReplyDeleteI am the author of the previous comment about discrimination against blacks. I just wanted to say--
Deleteif you guys thought it was sarcasm, yes it absolutely was, from my point of view. However, it is an almost exact transcription of the conversations 3 of my conservative acquaintances have had with me. Recently.
Be afraid. Be VERY afraid.
11:13 AM I fear no Bigoted Cowards.
DeleteIsn't the act of using God to hate merely an instrumentality of using God for fund-raising purposes? Remember the old saying in media, 'a fearful audience is a loyal audience'. 'Us against them', 'we're better than them', and 'divide and conquer', have been fund-raising ploys as long as I can remember. Thank goodness for an internet that so immediately and so devastatingly broadcasts the ugliness behind all their games.
DeleteWhat's on your mind today? Stay inform about the Palin happy times.
ReplyDeleteBe sure to register. Give the right gift to the beloved couple.
http://us4palin.com/
Screw the Dysfunctional palin family that has embarrassed all of Alaska.
DeleteWhy on earth would I want to spend a penny on these grifters? They have lived off other people for so long that they have no idea what is actually acceptable behavior for the normal person.
DeleteLet them eat cake.
What I really love is that it took "moderate" Jeb no time to get down into the stupid with the rest of the wingnuts. Damn, they are all so pitiful---always running against history.
ReplyDeleteIf these severe conservative laws promoting common sense real American conservative values must exist then it's only fair to require that they post a clear sign on their front doors identifying the groups they do not serve.
ReplyDeleteSort of a "Welcome Everyone! (except for the following people:....)" kind of thing.
We can assume these store owners are proud of their bigotry, they should be forced to declare it for all to see.
This policy would also revive an "honored" American tradition that slipped from use in the early 60s in the form of such signs as "Whites Only" or "Colored Only" for porcelain drinking fountains and rusty spigots, respectively or the always informative and charming "No Jews, No N!gg@rs, No Dogs".
Thanks, Republican assholes, for bringing back some of the worst of America traditions!
I happen to have a deeply held religious belief that it is wrong to serve black people in the same establishments as white people.
ReplyDeleteAfter all, God created the races separate, right? And He obviously intended for them to remain that way, you can tell this just by their vastly different geographical places of origin.
(Which, BTW, is absolutely NOT due to "evil-ution"!! It is because He Himself Did It!!)
I'm moving to Indiana tomorrow.
I smell bullshit. It's you.
DeleteKnock yourself out.
DeleteI know you're snarking, but back in the '50s and '60s religious douche-lords like Falwell spouted detailed, graphic variations of this exact hate-vomit without a shred of shame or irony. Hell, they were proud of themselves. Had Twitter existed back then, we'd be bombarded with crap like:
Delete"The LORD will judge and condemn this nation should the Negro mix with white man schoolin'!" #brylcreamcigarettepotatocasserolepolio
It's amazing that the GOP believes this backward, ignorant, evil thinking is going to win them the hearts and minds of the voters they need next year: not the Bible thumping GEDers who will vote GOP no matter who they hate, but the moderates and independents who really do study issues and vote their consciences. The GOP just lost ALL of this people, and show no signs of even wanting to win them back. Please proceed, GOP...you are getting ever closer to that cliff.
ReplyDeleteThis can work to Democrats advantage next year during the Presidential debates.
ReplyDeleteWho ever the Dem candidate is can hammer the ReTHUGliCON candidate, if one of them listed above gets that far.
11:09
ReplyDeleteYou have a right to your" religious" belief.please encourage your brethren to go with you. Hopefully you will be joined by other like minded geniuses in the immediate future. It will be interesting to watch this evolution. He himself does?
Best of luck fella.
.
Will these supposed Good Christians all close their businesses on Sundays to keep the Sabbath as their buy-bull instructs? If not, will the REAL Good Christians refuse to patronize said institutions until they do agree to honor the Sabbath?
ReplyDeleteYeah, riiight.
smh JJ
Brilliant point, Anonymous 11:38, since that commandment was literally carved in stone – twice!!! Not a peep from their mouths on that one.
DeleteWith one exception (and more soon to follow, no doubt): Scott Walker now proposes to eliminate 40-hour work week protections, so that Wisconsin employees will soon have to choose between getting weekends off and having a job in the first place. Walker, phony christian that he is, hopes to smash the carved-in-stone Sabbath commandment into the ground at his first opportunity. I expect the rest of the GOP, nationwide, to follow in his footsteps like lemmings.
Every time you think these hypocritical evil fuckers can't get any more evil and/or hypocritical, they up the ante.
ReplyDeletePence obviously didn't expect the backlash that erupted... he was so not prepared for it. Now he's backtracking, because he's being literally forced to. I'd say I love it, but I hate that it was even necessary.
I just saw on the local news that the governor of NY and the mayor of Rochester have joined the ever-growing parade of political leaders banning government funded travel to Indiana.
ReplyDeleteThe movement to shame Indiana for this law has taken on a life of its own and there's not much Pence or the Indiana legislators can do about it, short of repealing the law. Even then, the stink of it will linger in memories for a very long time.
Meanwhile the rest of the conservatives didn't learn any lessons from being on the wrong side of the marriage equality debate, and are hell bent on alienating even more potential voters.
I posted a link earlier that didn't make it through and don't have time to find the article again, but nine CEOs of huge IN-based businesses (including Eli Lilly and the very Repub Angie's list) have signed a letter opposing this bill. Angie's List has halted a planned $40mil expansion because of it.
DeleteWatch how fast these nimrods reverse their opinions when citizens start complaining about the loss of money and jobs.
Delete12:57 - I read in the IndyStar that one of the top executives at Angie's List is gay and that was one reason they made that decision.
DeleteIt seems like many of the Indiana state senators and representatives are scrambling to contain the damage and distance themselves from this political trainwreck. Good luck with that!
Rochester? holy sh*t, ROCHESTER? that is one of the more backwards NY towns - traditionally uber conservaCatholic. What did tey all do, move to Greece and ROme (NY?)
Delete3:01 - Actually the city of Rochester itself is quite solidly blue. It's many of the suburbs around the city and the rural areas around them that are more conservative.
DeleteBetween the city and some of the bluer suburbs, there are enough Democrats in our county to have repeatedly elected Louise Slaughter, who is one of the more outspoken (and feisty!) progressive Representatives in Congress.
I live in Greece but work in the city so I have political whiplash most of the time!
Religious freedom? In FL, not so much...
ReplyDeletehttp://patch.com/florida/newportrichey/naked-paint-parties-prompt-churchs-loss-tax-exempt-status
Pretty soon it'll be small businesses with "No Democrats" or "No Republicans" allowed signs in their windows. Then I'll know where I can shop.
ReplyDeleteReally hard for Pence to backpedal when his henchmen are giving these interviews: http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/03/watch-indiana-gop-leader-admits-no-gays-allowed-sign-would-be-legal-in-most-of-the-state/
ReplyDeleteI'm waiting for the first Evangelical Republican to put forward a law so government doesn't pay for gay mens Viagra. You know it's coming!!!
ReplyDeleteFreedom for Religious Bigotry Law
ReplyDeleteLet's just call it what it is.
Hoping this religious freedom law applies to me. I would want to bar armed wingnuts from my establishment. Because nothing would threaten the free practice of my religion like being accidentally shot dead by a careless idiot with a gun.
ReplyDeleteYou know... if you bake a cake for a homosexual, you're NOT letting him bugger you nor do you have to suck his dick.
ReplyDeleteYou're just baking a cake.
Mike Pence came out with a semi walk back, now they're calling for a repeal, not a re write. What will the assclowns in the peanut gallery do then????
ReplyDeleteAnonymous 10:57 AM Palin happy times? You are telling me to spend my money on these foul mouth ,rank and crude
ReplyDeletecrazies . You actually want me to buy the "beloved couple"
a wedding gift! People had better be buying the "beloved
couple" and their families gift cards to a funeral home
when Meyer's decides to end it, and takes them all with him. He truly is a ticking time bomb !
I bet their register list is mainly guns, targets with cross hairs,
booze and drugs!