Saturday, October 08, 2016

Former Ralph Nader supporters warn third party voters to learn from their mistake.

Seriously did you people learn nothing?
Courtesy of HuffPo: 

The Huffington Post spoke with Nader voters who have since figured out that the best way to fix the two-party system is to join it. They’ve worked in Democratic politics for years ― some as penance for what they did in 2000 ― and they worry that Stein voters are going to be making the same mistake they did with Nader. 

“If you think there’s no difference between Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton, then you’re not paying attention,” said Joe Rospars, who was the chief digital strategist for both of Barack Obama’s presidential campaigns and voted for Nader in Virginia when he was 19. “I don’t think that I’m just an old person now saying what an old person would have said to me 16 years ago. ... Voting for Jill Stein in a battleground state or Gary Johnson for any reason is just not a useful way to operate the electoral system.”

Nader took 2.7 percent of the vote in 2000, and there’s been a national argument ever since over whether he cost Gore the election. He received nearly 100,000 votes in Florida, a state in which Bush beat Gore by only 537 votes. 

People who went for Nader in 2000 have done their own soul-searching over the years, with plenty of accusations from friends that they led to things like the Iraq War. 

“Those of us who voted for Ralph Nader in 2000, most of us, if we had to do it over again, would not do it,” said Kurt Ehrenberg, 58, who served as Sen. Bernie Sanders’ (I-Vt.) New Hampshire political director but now solidly backs Clinton. “You feel, in some small way, responsible for all this stuff that George W. Bush was able to do because he was elected president ― even though it was the closest race in my lifetime and there’s still some question as to whether, if all the votes had been counted, Bush would’ve won.” 

I have been waiting for these folks to show up in this election cycle and talk some sense into those third party dipshits.

After all it was the 2000 election that turned me off to third party candidates in the first place.

First off, they are NEVER going to be elected.

Second their only purpose is to help one side or the other by stealing votes from their opponent.

And third don't give me that "protest vote" bullshit.

If you cast a vote for a third party candidate the only thing you are protesting is the lack of oxygen making it to your brain. You essentially knock yourself down a notch, from barely useful to the political system to completely insignificant.



  1. Anonymous7:06 AM


    1. Anonymous7:17 AM

      "I can’t imagine a modern politician standing up and saying, “I’m working on my own edition of the Bible in which I’m cutting out sections.” And some Founding Fathers had very little or no faith. Others on occasion manipulated people with faith to achieve a certain outcome or goal."

      I CAN> donald j drumpf

    2. Anonymous7:36 AM

      Cutting out sections is their forte! Let's start with The Sermon On The Mount Matthew 5.

    3. Anonymous8:17 AM

      $arah never made it out of the Old Testament.

  2. Anonymous7:31 AM

    Fat Fuck Crispy Creamer came up in court> LOL! Interesting> "Renna's testimony in the trial of Kelly and Bill Baroni, a former Port Authority executive, took on the feeling of an episode of "Real Housewives of New Jersey," with talk of grudges, sabotage and expressions of feigned hate."

    1. Anonymous8:18 AM

      I imagine the media are enjoying it. I would.

  3. Anonymous8:11 AM

    Why can't you make your points without disparaging people who are struggling with how to vote? I get it that you're worried Hillary will lose and they're wasting their vote, but must you be so nasty? And I ask because you don't seem to be a nasty person, based on most your other posts.

    1. Like I said after 2000 I lost all sympathy for third party voters.

      If you cannot see the big picture, and put aside your arrogant belief that your vote is some precious commodity which only a candidate who passes your ideological test deserves to have, then for all intents and purposes you are essentially useless. At least in a political sense.

    2. Anonymous8:36 AM

      How can anyone be struggling with who to vote for in this election?

      Watch PBS Frontline the Choice, they are airing it again before the debate.

    3. Anonymous8:41 AM

      Gryphen, circa 2 weeks ago.

      "Personally I am thrilled that people are breaking from the herd and standing up for their beliefs."
      "As a progressive I feel that the more people stop and ask the hard questions about traditions, religion, and patriotism, the better for all of us in the long run."
      "We should always think before we do, question before we accept, and learn before we decide."

      "As a progressive I feel that the more people stop and ask the har
      We should always think before we do, question before we accept, and learn before we decide.

    4. Anonymous8:43 AM

      Gryphen has lots of keyboard and liquid courage. He knows the odds of actually meeting one of his hateful followers in person is virtually nil. He's safe sitting in his basement in his dirty boxers insulting who ever doesn't meet his agenda

    5. Anonymous8:48 AM

      I have to wonder about anyone who claims they are still struggling with who to vote for.

    6. Still true 8:41, but nowhere in that post did I encourage people to throw away their votes.

      And 8:43 joke's on you, not wearing boxers today.

    7. Anon @ 8:41 Just one of Gryphen's many hypocrital statements. One of my favorites is when he claimed to have sex with some married women because they threw themselves at him. Yet he judges the Palin's for the same thing.

    8. Anonymous9:00 AM

      That just shows how truly pathetic you are.

    9. Anonymous9:02 AM

      Our 3 Alaskan Electoral votes always go to the Republican candidate so basically I can write in Pennywise the Clown for POTUS and it won't really matter. . .

    10. Anonymous9:06 AM

      Anon @ 8:41 Gryphen plagerized those words from:

      Of course he will never post this on his blog.

    11. Okay 9:06 that whole website is made up of posts plagiarizing me, not the other way around.

    12. Anonymous9:21 AM


    13. Anonymous9:33 AM

      Grypen, that just took you to a whole new level of narcissism

    14. Anonymous10:52 AM

      Well I just love irony Gryph. And the quotes pulled from your post a couple weeks ago, ironically were about the young attention seeking lady in the military who thought she would be really cool by joining and the rest of the herd in the current popular trend of sitting thru the national anthem, started by Colin Kaepernick. So basically your idea of breaking the herd.... is just joining the cool herd of the day lol.

      It is akin to all the 20, 30, and 40 somethings who think they are something special and really cool and being indiviualistic and edgy by getting full arm sleeve tattoos..... you know, ones just like all their hipster trend following peers have.

      Come to think of it, ironically, Mr. Individual Kaepernick has full arm sleeve tatoos himself, that I'm sure he tells everyone that the tatoos mean something deep and define him. So cool, lol.

    15. Anonymous12:25 PM


      When I was in the mainstream workforce I had to turn away countless job seekers because they are overly tattooed. They had the choice of covering them with clothing, but some creep up their necks only being able to be covered with turtlenecks and even some were still visible.

      These kids just don't realize the problems they cause themselves by having this body "art" but there were plenty more qualified applicants that aren't covered in ink. Companies must have their standards.

      There is a reason that this generation is turning more towards entrepreneurism and self-employment, it's because they aren't hirable by self-respecting companies.

      I wish them all the luck in the world as they age and those nasty tats fade and sag and they suffer from tattoo ink caused dermatitis. That shit is for life.

    16. Anonymous2:20 PM

      Yes I do know what you are talking about 12:25. Many or most of these indivuals (and it is probably 50% of the population these days) are perfectly capable, like you said more or less. Hell most are suburban kids that grew up middle or upper middle class in perfectly suburban households and are decently educated. I just see a severe character flaw in their personalities as being weak, easily swayed, feeling the need to display some type of persona that really doesn't exist. Frankly, most are just plain bores totally unaware of 'self'.

      And lets not get started on the stupid stupid stupid earlobe hoop holes. F-ing dipshits.

  4. Anonymous8:13 AM

    LOL at Regretful Kurt who went from Nader to Sanders. Yep, he really learned.

  5. Anonymous8:24 AM


    Wiki dump of Podesta emails and Clinton emails:

    Malcolm Nance tweet (Oct 7, 7:43pm -- who is well respected US Intelligence +35 yrs. Expert AQ/ISIL/Jihadi Strategy & Tactics, Ideology. Torture, SERE | NY Times Bestselling Author, Navy Senior Chief. NBC/MSNBC analyst:

    "Official Warning: #PodestaEmails are already proving to be riddled with obvious forgeries & #blackpropaganda not even professionally done".

    FOXHole's Megyn Kelly was forced to apologize for quoting 'doctored' dump docs!!!

    How rare to hear 'facts' on FOXHole!!! Hurry -- I need smelling salts!!

  6. Anonymous8:31 AM

    And congratulations to you good sir, for sticking with the herd, never straying from the pre-selected establishment candidate, chosen so that you don't really have to do anything. We appreciate your waiving of free will and intelligent thought in exchange for our guarantee of slightly less fear.

    The Company

  7. Anonymous8:37 AM

    Damn you are one arrogant know it all. From calling your little cult kids to telling them how to vote while insulting them. The reason you have so much time to be on here is obvious, no one likes to be around you in person. You are one hateful little man. Oh, I am not a Palin or Dakota, never met them, never want to. I'm just someone who can think for himself.

    1. Anonymous9:06 AM

      Anon 8:37
      You "think for himself"? Really? LOL

      Your post speaks volumes that you're just another like Trump. You're thinking is done from the area 'below the belt'

  8. Anonymous8:38 AM

    You've got a right to your opinion. But here's the hard truth:
    - Our Constitution guarantees the right for anyone who qualifies to run for president.
    - Our Constitution does not enshrine a two-party system.
    - This is a Republic. People have the right to vote for whomever they wish who's on the ballot.
    - In my experience, calling people insulting names is usually not a successful way to persuade them to your point of view.

    In my view, your vitriol is misdirected. This election shouldn't even be close, Johnson and Stein notwithstanding. Clinton should be 30 points ahead of that freakshow carnival barker and votes going to the other two shouldn't even matter. I think the blame, and your misdirected vitriol, really belongs on Clinton and the DNC for being complacent, arrogant and over-confident so now they're playing defense.

    1. The election isn't close check the new polls.

      And much of Clinton's problems with some so-called "progressives" is that they swallowed the Right Wing talking points about Hillary being a criminal, a liar, and that she was bought and paid for by Wall Street.

      The Bernie Bros parroted those talking points to the left until they became baked in, and now it has become harder than ever, even for Sanders, to correct that interpretation.

    2. I listened to an interview on NPR with 3 millenial voters, all of whom had supported Bernie, and 2 of whom are voting for Johnson, and one for that nitwit Stein (yes, my bias is showing because I've listened to her several times and concluded she is INDEED a nitwit). Anyhow, as I was listening to them give their reasons, I couldn't help but wonder how they were once so rabidly for Bernie, and yet now are not willing to take Bernie's advice and vote for Hillary. Strange, huh?

    3. Anonymous10:11 AM

      If you believe the new polls say the race isn't close, then you have no basis for the rant above.

    4. Anonymous10:20 AM

      Because, Maple, it's never been a movement where Bernie could snap his fingers and the faithful would fall in line. It's always been about the ideology, not the messenger.

    5. @10:20: So what does that tell you about Bernie's "ideology" then?

    6. Anonymous12:29 PM

      It tells me they don't believe Clinton will promote or deliver any of Bernie's ideas that are in the platform. They won't vote for Trump and turns out they have 3 other choices: Johnson, Stein or leave it blank. You're going to exercise your right to vote for whom you like. Leave people the fuck alone to exercise their right. If the race really is not even close as Gryphen claimed earlier, this insulting and bullying of your fellow Americans who don't see things the way you do is even more offensive.

    7. Sorry to disappoint you, 12:29 but I'm merely an interested (and concerned) Canadian. And BTW, I haven't tried to influence anyone to vote a certain way. I merely stated what I'd heard, and then asked a question. Get over yourself, honey. Oh, and I live in a country that has 3 major political parties, as well as several minor ones. I know the value of a 3-party system which can work in a parliamentary democracy, but I also know that the third party usually ends up with either a "further left" or "further right" ideology, and can (and frequently does) act as a spoiler, depending on one's political leanings. Not always a good thing, IMHO.

    8. Anonymous3:35 PM

      It's not about me so there's nothing to get over and I'm not your honey. No candidate is a "spoiler". That's just sour grapes. And of course Gryphen invalidated his rant about Johnson and Stein voters when he claimed the latest polls show the race isn't even close. Polls that of course have Johnson and Stein in them. He and his compas who love to bash anyone who doesn't agree with them can't have it both ways - if the race is not even close, then the votes for Johnson or Stein don't matter. Those voters aren't to blame for bringing the end of the world as we know it or whatever other hysteria the Clintonites are peddling this week.

  9. Anonymous8:41 AM

    To hear the ReTHUGS up in arms about Trump now -- those same ReTHUGS that have done the same as Trump by way of their actions to force women to be forcefully 'probed' when having an abortion. Whether it's a probe or their 'Wee Willy' -- it's sexual assault. All the bills in various States and those that have been put forward by co-sponsors Paul Ryan and Todd 'Legitimate Rape' Akin re Fetal Personhood -- assault on women.

    All these ReTHUGS now acting like they care about women -- NO THEY DON'T. They only care about a WIN for the ReTHUGlican party. They don't care about country. They like Trump only care about their own election survival.

    It's been evident for years. To waste Millions of taxpayer dollars to vote over 50 times to repeal Obamacare -- They have displayed that if your Granny dies because of no healthcare or people lose their house because of medical bills -- as long as they have their 'elected' job -- they don't give a rat'sass about people other than themselves and don't care about the country.

    I state that the members of the ReTHUGlican Party are no different than Trump -- they are sexual assaulters.

    1. In denouncing Trump, Paul Ryan says women "should be revered and championed". No, you idiot, women should be respected and treated as equals. That's all we want; we have no aspirations to be your Madonna.

  10. Anonymous9:27 AM

    For all those mouthpieces like Joe Scarborough, Mika, Hugh Hewitt etc etc that have many many times stated that the Trump we see as candidate is not the Trump we know as a friend who they socialize in private.

    It's clear not one of them have owned up to fact he conned them all -- in their private socializations.

    He's like that sleazy used car salesman -- he'll say anything to 'sell himself'. I've alway referred to used car salesmen as 'they'd screw their mothers given the opportunity'.

    Those 'talking heads' with a mic are so 2-faced. They are no different than Trump -- they're narcissists and 'right fighters' as they can't see themselves being wrong.

  11. Anonymous10:59 AM

    I will agree that a protest vote is dangerous in a battleground state. However, in a state that is not purple, it can be used in a valid way to try to influence local politics.

  12. Yah, yah, yah, anyone who doesn't want to vote Republican or Democrat is an idiot. Voting your conscience is stupid. You people aren't smart enough to vote for those you believe will be best for the country. You have to vote the way I want or be ridiculed and sent for an IQ test.

    Or...... Maybe it's those voting for Dems or Republicans who are brain cell challenged. The Dems and Republicans are the ones who got us where we are today. But you're so all knowing, I guess we all need to follow your lead.


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