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| Egyptian Muslim clutching his Koran alongside Egyptian Christian holding the cross. |
"The Muslim Brotherhood takes Islam as a template, but we don't have a religious state or God-ordained rule," says Ibrahim Zakaria, a Brotherhood official and former member of parliament. "We believe in democracy and all its rules. We believe in the principle that the people are the origin and source of sovereignty, and that the people chose their leaders in free and secret ballots."
But here is my question: Does freedom not taste as sweet to all oppressed people, regardless of how they worship or the color of the their skin? And if they were able to work together to bring that freedom to their people, would that not unite them as brothers, making it much easier to work side by side to establish a government that respects all religions?
I am trying to remember where I heard that a similar thing take place once before, several centuries ago, but for some reason it seems to have slipped my mind.
I hope this does work out.
ReplyDeleteShamefully, America is going the opposite direction is some ways. Intolerance by evangelicals has been on the rise for several years, and the GOP/TP seem to be underwriting it (along with wealthy backers such as the Koch Brothers and Murdoch).
I hope Egypt and America can find a way to allow people of all colors and spiritual beliefs live in harmony.
Peace be with us all.
Well for one thing the Muslim Brotherhood doesn't have as far a reach in Egypt as some might insist. But, they have clarified time and time again that they believe in a diverse and tolerant society.
ReplyDeleteRemember, these are Sunni Muslims, they are not Shia like the folks in Iran. Iranians aren't even being allowed into Egypt right now, I can tell you from personal knowledge.
There have been beautiful stories out of Egypt which demonstrate a respectful and harmonious relationship between Christians and Muslims in this time of crisis. Doubt that would be happening if the Muslim Brotherhood were determined to take over the world, as Glenn Beck would have you believe.
We need to get past the paranoia and the stereotyping.
Fear mongering plain and simple. Shame on those Americans, including Sarah Palin, for trying to paint all Muslims as evil. There are far too many unemployed, poorly educated people listening to Glenn Beck et al. I am glad glad GLAD to be a Canadian.
ReplyDeleteGriffin - I wouldn't use the US historical example as the paradigm for freedom for people of all colors. The 17.6% of the population that were slaves would probably disagree.
ReplyDeleteI don't know why we think that Egypt, if left to its own people and army, will be some sort of progressive democracy. They sympathized with the Nazi's (hoping they would drive the British out), have fought multiple wars with Israel, and have a horrid human rights record that stretches back decades. Even today, with their peace treaty, Egyptian state media is virulently antisemetic by any objective standards.
Hopes and dreams aren't going to cause a progressive democracy to spring forth in Egypt. If this state fails, it will either serve as a breeding ground for anti-western islamists or the army will once again take over.
This popped into my head this morning...that anyplace Sarah Palin is to "speak" it should be billed as:
ReplyDeleteA CELEBRATION OF AMERICAN IGNORANCE, AGGRESSION, AND PARANOIA
What may have caused such a thought is the frightening amount of people who I hear uttering phrases such as, "Why don't we just invade Egypt and put in a leader who'll be to our liking?"
It wasn't that long ago, that we assigned such evil behaviour, exclusively to the Nazis and Communists...and American forces were sent in, very reluctantly, only when the bullies were squashing the little guys.
Can we really blame all the countries who are trying to arm themselves with nuclear weapons, to stave off invasion by the new bully on the block?
Do these warmongering "christians" not realize how the rest of the world is coming to view America?
The media loves to stoke controversy, so a smooth transition and a positive message just doesn't fit their agenda all that well. They're mostly not looking for a heart warming story, they want conflict and pitting of one against the other. That's what grabs the headlines in this media culture we all labor under.
ReplyDeleteIf Fox didn't have the 'bad guys' to carry on about, they'd be out of business. Fast. Which in my opinion would be one of the best things that could ever happen in this country. Guaranteed it would be a much calmer, literate and reasonable place without the talking heads stirring the pot on a daily basis. I mean, for god's sake, they're in a snit because Obama wasn't wearing a tie? Give me a break. That's the best that they can do?
Just imagine for a moment a world without Fox 'News'.
Hopefully, Egyptians will attain their freedom- from neo-cons like Lieberman and rapture types like Huckabee.
ReplyDeleteNow that Mubarak is off the payroll, Israel might be more inclined to, finally, get out of the Occupied Territories. That would be nice for the US too!
That sounds very good and I hope you are right, Gryphen. It's just that when revolutions happen in Muslim countries, the rights of women are in severe jeopardy, and in several cases have gone backward.
ReplyDeleteEgypt is somewhat secular, but also 90 PERCENT of Egyptian women have been circumcised. It was outlawed in 2007, but of course it is still done, not sure at what rate.
I think the many people of Egypt living on less than 2 dollars a day AND having to use some of it to bribe their own police for protection, probably just want a change.
ReplyDeleteThere's about 80 million people in Egypt and the USA gives them 1.5 billion per year. Trickle down econmics in action.
Obama Besting Palin In Deeply Republican Tennessee: Poll
ReplyDeleteForty-two percent of respondents said they'd vote for Obama, while 37 percent said they'd pick the former Alaska governor, the Tennessean reported on Monday. This, in a state that hasn't gone for a Democratic presidential candidate since Bill Clinton in 1996 -- even though the party's nominee in 2000, former Vice President Al Gore, called Tennessee his home.
The Vanderbilt numbers are hardly concrete. Palin is not yet a candidate, and a lot can happen in nearly two years, especially with the unemployment rate widely expected to remain above 9 percent this year and above 8 percent at the end of 2012.
But the poll findings still represent a telling data point as Republican voters survey the field of prospective candidates. Late last month, the progressive-leaning survey firm Public Policy Polling found that, were Palin on the ballot, Texas would become a swing state, with 47 percent of Texan respondents saying they'd vote for the 2008 Republican vice-presidential nominee while 46 percent said they'd back Obama.
In Tennessee, Obama even bested Palin among self-identified independent voters by a solid 12-point margin, 44 to 32 percent. Among self-described moderates, the margin is a staggering 33 points, 57 percent to 24 percent.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/07/poll-obama-beating-palin-tennessee_n_819588.html
Wish that photo had a Jew holding a Star of David in it as well. Now, that would be progress.
ReplyDeleteI really wish religion wasn't such a powerful force in any country. Morality and compassion yes; religious dogma of any sort, no.
Palin and probably the majority of the Foxhole idiots have never heard of the Muslim Brotherhood before last week.
ReplyDeleteWhat it does do is present them with their new 'boogeyman' which in turn will reraise the issue of the NYC Mosque and the others around the country.
If it wasn't for the cold and snow because they are truly wimps - they would be out ranting and raving protesting the Mosque issue once again. If it hasn't been said on the Foxhole yet, I'm sure it will surface soon being that much of the media have left Egypt and returned back to the US as the 'hot' story of the day to the media is over. Truthfully, the MSM has the attention span of a gnat.
If the Muslim Brotherhood is not bent on the destruction of Israel, they best distance themselves as far as possible from Hamas, an organization that came from the brotherhood and that the brotherhood is deeply connected to. It is a terrorist organization that calls for the destruction of Israel, sprouts anti-semitic rhetoric in its very charter, and has made life very difficult for the Palestinian people.
ReplyDeleteThey were, as we all know, democratically elected.
I, of course, believe that democracy is the absolute ideal, but it doesn't necessarily "unite people as brothers….making it easier to establish a government that respects all religions."
That is one of the most beautiful pictures I've ever seen.
ReplyDeleteNeedless to say, it's not on the front page of the New York Times, or on the AP website's first page of photo's a search for "Egypt protest" generates.
Nor is it on the front page of the news sections on the websites for abc, nbc, or cbs*.
Of course there's no sign of it anywhere on the Fox"News" website, front page or otherwise. Quite the opposite, they're doing as they always do: stirring up paranoid fears of Christianists, despite having a similar photo showing a Coptic priest and a Muslim Imam protesting together!
Finally, there's no sign of it on the first 10 pages of a Google® search on "Egypt protest."
Thank you, "liberal media," for keeping us so well informed!
And -- seriously -- Thank God for you, Gryphen, for doing their job for them.
Be nice if the mass media were still in the journalism biz. But since they clearly aren't, I'm really, really glad there are people like you to pitch in.
*fun fact: there is NO mention on the cbstv website’s main page that they even have a news division, or any news shows; not one.
I wish to God I were kidding.
No, not all people are freedom-loving and yes religion DOES matter. Religion is dogma and domination, and the mixing of state and religion is never a good idea. No religion should crowd out state secularism, or be used as a "template." It's exactly what the Sarah nuts here want to do with their "seven mountains" domination idea.
ReplyDeleteAnd no, democracy isn't just about a ballot. Remember when Hamas got elected democratically? Anyone can get "elected." Hitler rose to power by popular vote, too. People loved him and were suspicious of the jews and foreigners. A thriving democracy requires an educated and stable middle class, and a constitution which protects minority rights. Women need opportunity in free societies as well, otherwise it will stagnate.
I am hoping Egypt is on the right path. This is certainly an exciting moment for them.
I am really for freedom of religion and I feel badly for the American Muslim community. No one should be vilified.
ReplyDeleteBut I do think Gryphen that you and others are unbelievabli naive about Islamic extremism. It is more prevalent and more dangerous than you think. There are extremists in every religion but most won't strap bombs on themselves to die as martyrs.
Are you really even educated about this topic to spout out your opinions?? With all due respect, please do some serious reading and research before declaring who and who isn't dangerous. Did you know anything about Domionism before?
I am liberal but I find some liberals to be incredibly uneducated about the dangers of Islamic extremists. Didn't you listen to that smart young Lesbian Arab woman on Bill Mahr? She talks about this dangerous element and how it shouldn't be ignored.
It would not be a good thing for the Muslim brotherhood to be in charge of Egypyt. The fact that you think it's ok tells
me you are not well read and again you are extremely naive to the point of ignorance.
Anon 12:14, oh gee and you honestly think that would bring peace to the middle east?? It wouldn't!!
ReplyDeleteListen to those writing about Hamas. Hamas and Hezbollah are terrible and dangerous influences. Kids grow up learning to hate Christians, the west and Jews. Not dislike or distrust - hate and kill. If you think this is not a threat and a problem you are woefully unaware. Have any of you actually read the Koran or do you just repeat what other liberals tell you. The extremists in EVERY religion Nd country are a problem. I'm not defending Sarah and her hate. I missed what she said. But to pretend extra
ReplyDeleteIsm isn't very dangerous is not smart.