I had actually started to write a post about this earlier in the week when the cover was first revealed but, like many men, I found myself really intimidated by the subject.
My first instinct then I saw this cover was that this mother was really screwing her child up.
As I have already shared with all of you I have spent much of my life working with women, so I have had plenty of time to get used to being around breastfeeding. But oddly enough I have NEVER become completely comfortable.
I remember one incident when I was coaching gymnastics, and was teaching a class of four year old children that were brought to the gym by their mommies who carpooled together.
After the class I walked up to the group of mostly young moms to talk about their children's progress, and one of the younger, more attractive mothers engaged me in a one on one conversation. Part way through the conversation the shawl that she had draped over her shoulders and bosom fell away to reveal a nursing baby that for some reason I had not known was there at first.
The sight literally stopped me in mid sentence and I my eyes were suddenly riveted to her now revealed breast and the child attached. I was completely embarrassed and realized that I was openly staring at this woman's naked bosom and had to turn my entire body in order to tear my now fixated eyes away.
In my mind all I could think of was that I had sexually objectified this woman and I immediately needed to apologize, However before I could, I was met with howls of laughter from the mothers who started to tease me for my discomfort. When I turned back to face the group, with my face now an unmistakeable scarlet color, they only laughed harder, with the breastfeeding mom saying, "It's just a boob Jesse. No need to be embarrassed. Surely YOU have seen a naked boob before."
Well of course I had seen many, but I certainly did not expect to see hers, and I certainly not expected it to make an appearance during a conversation about gymnastics.
After that when I walked by this group of ladies they would tease me by calling out that it was safe to come over and talk to them because "we have our breasts in storage."
The point of course is that even though breastfeeding is possibly the MOST natural thing in the world, it can STILL cause controversy and make otherwise perfectly progressive people uncomfortable, at least momentarily.
Which of course was my initial reaction to this Time magazine cover. And the fact that it was a four year old boy just made that discomfort all the worse.
So I have shared my conflicted opinions on this topic, what are yours?
(BTW, apparently this woman has now had to deal with threats for appearing on the the cover.)
I think four is a bit old to be breast fed. To the age of two, children are MUCH less likely to develop food allergies and intolerances. After that, I'm not sure there is much benefit. The SNL video was flipping hilarious!!!
ReplyDeleteI always liked the stories of a mother and her child who together worked in the fields. At lunchtime, the child drank mom's milk, then wiped its face and for dessert, lit up a big cigar.
ReplyDeleteThe ability to lactate for prolonged periods is extremely helpful to survival of the species, when food supplies are short.
ReplyDeleteThat said, sprouting teeth is nature's way of handing you a clue. I always wonder whose needs are being met when I see people still breastfeeding when the kid is past 2. It's not the kid's, because by then they are perfectly able to take solids. And like it or not, breasts are highly sexualized in our culture: I really wonder how these kids are going to feel when they're old enough to realize this, and yet can remember being breastfed. There's a difference between knowing one was a breastfed baby, and being remembering it happening while you were old enough to eat at McDonald's.
Ivyfree
Ivyfree
Ivyfree
Good lord. I have no idea why that repeated my name so often!
DeleteIvyfree
I don't have a problem with a mother breastfeeding a toddler. But putting him on the cover of a national magazine is awful. She has no doubt wrecked his life.
ReplyDeleteGryphen, Seth really tears it up!
ReplyDeleteI am a woman and I am uncomfortable around women openly "nursing".
Lets face it in this society women's breasts are objectified, we are told we have to have big boobs so we buy fancy bra's or Belmont girls like Baldy...
And then we expect to whip out a boob ANYWHERE to feed a kid?
And the Time mag is really Sicko!
I can see a mom discreetly breast feeding a child. But this kid is like 4 yrs old! Where do you draw the line?
As Seth said "With a mom like this EVERYDAY will be Mommy's day"
I see this as child abuse.
I can't decide which is worse. Posing for a Time magazine cover,nursing a toddler or commercial exploiting a toddler by putting him on magazine covers, using him as a wedge against his father and trying to use him as the star of a tv reality show.
ReplyDeleteSpeaking of reality shows, I heard the rumor that the Professional Single Christian Teen Mom and her latest guy of the hour had broken up-- true or not true?? Trolls, please write and tell me how happy they are, that they are rehabbing a house together, planning a family together, and oh, wait a minute. Wasn't she the gal who said that gay marriage was a no no suggested by girls who watch Glee, and marriage should be between a man and a woman? Didn't she criticize President Obama for listening to his kids (what a guy!) instead of leading them in the right direction? Why doesn't she allow her kid's father the right to do the same thing? Come on, Trolls, please do tell us how she is the perfect mother, exploiting her kid the way that her mother exploited her children. What a tribute to Mothers Day!
To Bristol: Remember that by keeping your child away from his father you are doing him a great disservice, and exposing yourself as a complete hypocrite. I don't understand how the court can allow this behavior--keeping your child's father out of his life (and bragging about it in interviews) when he asks to see him and texts you to let him spend the night. Please know that when your child says "I love you, Mommy" that you are neglecting him in the biggest way imaginable. Knowing that your parent was ripped from your life leaves huge emotional scars on children as they grow up. Tripp will hate you one day for what you have done. Happy Mother's Day!
DeleteLevi, I hope you find yourself an attorney that will fight for your right as the father of your child. Tripp will remember when he is older that you did the right thing and fought for him.
I don't so much see a nursing mother in this magazine cover. First off, it is a magazine cover and a photo shoot. Everyone will have their point of view. It is getting people engaged in discussions.
DeleteAttachment bonds are as unique as we are. Primary caretakers don’t have to be perfect. They do not have to always be in tune with their infants’ emotions, but it helps if they are emotionally available a majority of the time.
Insecure attachment affects adult relationships
These insecurities may lead us to: Tune out and turn off—Remain insecure—Become disorganized, aggressive and angry—Develop slowly—
Prior to Mother's Day the Brancy blog allowed Bristol Palin to honor her father. No mention of her son's father. Son's father is a very taboo subject in the Palin camp. It is also a deep abandonment problem for Bristol's son, Tripp. Children can form bonds with both parents when they are both available. As the Palin's have shown us, Tripp has lived in a three ring circus when it comes to moving around and the father figures in his life. We only know of a few, Levi Johnston, Ben Barber, the Massey brothers, and Gino Paoletti. In and out, Anchorage to Los Angeles. It has been some ride for the child.
Sarah and Bristol in the good Christian role play will have their routine courtesy blog posts to Mother. If the darkside is in control, who knows what they will neglect or do?
Dogs and all animals wean their cubs and teach them to hunt or whatever as part of their childhood.
ReplyDeleteAs the poster above stated...Teeth are a clue!
I will bet this mom is a Conservative.
The six inch heels give a clue.
Who is being satisfied by this behavior?
The woman is sick. This is not a third world country where HER milk is the only thing a child needs, if she can afford six inch heels she can afford to buy real food for the kid.
And that is a 4 year old kid!
Not a "Baby".
Uh, not understanding your comment.
DeleteYou said "six inch high heels" twice. That seems to be the real issue for you.
Note: she has ballet flats on.
She did an interview on Nightline where she was wearing 6 inch heels.
DeleteWho?
Delete"I will bet this mom is a Conservative.
The six inch heels give a clue."
In the visual image posted on this blog entry, there is a woman nursing a child that appears to be a little boy standing on a small wooden chair. The woman is dressed in black tanktop and pants and a pair of flats.
That's what the comments are referring to.
It's okay, Jesse. Rightly or wrongly, I'm not comfortable with it in public with exposed breasts, and with a four year old, not that either. It's a highly individual thing...both for the mom and you or me.
ReplyDeleteIt's very intimate. I am a seasoned breastfeeder, and I never felt comfortable doing it in public, unless I absolutely had to. We planned our outings to the babies' feeding schedule and it was much better for the both of us. It was our time together to bond, unwind and relax.
DeleteThat kid is too old to be breastfeeding, period.
ReplyDeleteThat mother and Time Magazine are both sick for putting this on the cover!! Anything to sell magazines and she got her 15 minutes of fame..maybe we'll see Sarah or Bristol doing this also too, anything for ATTENTION!!
ReplyDeleteIt's obviously to get a reaction. Which it has.
ReplyDeleteIt's already being 'sexified'. America reveals, yet again, its preoccupation with sex.
This is a perfect illustration of how we collectively view EVERYTHING from a sexual perspective.
Oedipus much, anyone?
Breastfeeding would barely rate a parenting magazine cover in Europe; certainly not a major news publication.
But then, they wouldn't put someone like Sarah Palin on a cover either, would they.
Hey, Americans. Instead of teaching your little girls to wear little plastic toy boudoir high heels and shop at WalMart, how about you teach them to do math, speak classical foreign languages and play musical instruments?
How about instead of covering them with 'Hannah Montana' logos, you cover them in androgynous 'Hannah Anderson' cotton clothing?
How about you empower your girls, instead of making them rape victims?
No, MimiC, she has not wrecked his life. She's wrecked hers.
"Instead of teaching your little girls to wear little plastic toy boudoir high heels and shop at WalMart, how about you teach them to do math, speak classical foreign languages and play musical instruments? "
DeleteAs a teacher I say "Amen!" to that idea!
Oh I don't know about that. Some day, most likely in a short few years, this kid is going to get the shit teased out of him for being a big BABY still sucking on mommy's teats at such a late age. Nope she did ruin the kid's life if you look at it like another kid would.
Delete"...if you look at it like another kid would."
DeleteUh, no. We're supposed to be grown-ups. I'll look at it that way.
You might be right. Kids are mean, given the opportunity. I think this kid is probably privileged and well-cared for. Maybe goes to private school.
I think in the end, he'll be in khakis and button-downs, graduating with honors and in the executive world.
This ain't a WalMart mom. This is an educated woman of substance. Probably has a well-employed husband. A life of plenty.
Nobody else would have the guts to let it all hang out like that.
I'm guessing, of course.
I think the difference between your conflicted feelings, and the conflicted feelings of some others, is that you felt no need to make someone ELSE (namely the nursing mom!) feel uncomfortable with you! Thank you for that, by the way.
ReplyDeleteI breastfed both my children for, what is considered by much of American culture, an extended length of time. I didn't get tons of harassment, probably because my husband is scary looking, but I did get many uncomfortable glances.
From day one, my poor FIL would leave the room when I nursed, even in his own house. My MIL told me it was because he was uncomfortable, and afraid to make ME uncomfortable and possibly damage my healthy nursing relationship with my children, his grandchildren. I was floored and humbled by his touching gesture, and from then on, I would nurse in another room at his house.
My point is that ALL moms need all the support they can get in their parenting choices, even if some of those choices make others uncomfortable. Motherhood is fraught with insecurity, worry, terror, and sleep deprivation. We don't need others questioning our ability to parent, we do just fine on our own! Any support, even the absence of condemnation, is support, and we'll take it!
I applaud you for not foisting your warring feeling on that mom. I applaud the other women for supporting her. And most of all I applaud that you "took one for the team," and allowed yourself to be the object of their good-natured ribbing. I'm positive that mom was more bolstered that you know. Sometimes it takes one small act to give a mom the courage she needs to do what she feels is best for her child/ren. Good job!
Sorry for the long-winded rant. I'm a little passionate about this, can you tell? :)
I wholeheartedly agree, Rubiy.
DeleteHAPPY MOTHER'S DAY
ReplyDeleteFamous Moms And Daughters Who Write Together
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jocelyn-kelley/moms-write_b_1510114.html?ref=books
Photos that changed America
http://www.artbook.com/9781935202769.html
Workers tell how drugs, debt bind them in modern slavery
http://tinyurl.com/7tng93f
Time must replace that mother and child with Sarah and Bristol.
DeleteAttachment bonding: The attachment bond shapes an infant’s brain. To demostrate how important it is to get it right and what it is when it goes wrong, the perfect mother and child would be Sarah and Bristol. How many 20 yo children have mom do a blog and pay for the ghost writer. Time missed the boat if they want to make a statement about attachment bonds.
The attachment bond theory states that the relationship between infants and primary caretakers is responsible for:
shaping all of our future relationships
strengthening or damaging our abilities to focus, be conscious of our feelings, and calm ourselves
the ability to bounce back from misfortune
9:09 AM
DeleteIt was not that long ago that Tori Spelling was schooling Sarah Palin an lactating and pregnancy. Tori was using "nature's contraceptive" after baby3. She is now pregnant with baby4.
...and Bristol Palin rated a joke and photograph featured as well! Unbelievable!
ReplyDeleteC'mon, SNL writers, Seth Myers. REALLY?
Obviously, her marketing is working. SNL writers READ HER BLOG???! REALLY?
The only thing "wrong" with this cover is that there is no mother/child bonding. I've personally never seen someone nursing their child in this manner. Always it has been in a cuddling position, mother gazing at child, child looking lovingly at mom, etc. This photo was taken for it's sensationalism and to sell a magazine. IMO just another card in the deck of the war on women. In many cultures children weren't weened until 3 years old or later. Breast milk is the single best source of nutrition for many children. Good nutrition for children results in healthier adults, and a healthier society as a whole. The child I nursed the longest (until the age of 3) has been healthier and had a better immune system than my other 3 children. Proof enough for me that I made the right decision. I'm sure the formula companies and their investors LOVE this controversy. With all the negative press, sadly many new mothers will now choose formula. There's no money for the corporations if a mother is nursing. Wake up people.
ReplyDeleteIt's a photo shoot. Not a nursing mother.
DeleteYou didn't watch the video, did you?
DeleteThank you. Just what I was thinking. Come on, folks, start thinking even a little out of the box.
DeleteFor starters - I'm not comfortable with the idea of breastfeeding a child of this age unless one lives in a place where there is little to no food available, and while such places exist on this Earth, the USA isn't one of them. However, as a woman, I'm very comfortable with the idea of women breastfeeding in public. In fact, I don't even think of it as odd, since this is exactly what breasts are for.
ReplyDeleteAs for the sexualization of breasts in this country - it's not generally women who've made that happen. Instead of making breastfeeding women cover up like they're wearing chadors, or hide away at home, as if breastfeeding is something to be ashamed of because OMG A MAN MIGHT SEE MY BOOB AND BE OVERWHELMED WITH SEXYTIME THOUGHTS (sorry, Gryph)......
Maybe it's just time MEN got over their breast fetishes.
We'll work on the high heel fetish next.
Really, people? War on breastfeeding? Seriously, breasts are specifically designed for the purpose of delivering milk - we're mammals. Shiny object much?
ReplyDeleteMan, did the editors and publishers of TIME Magazine have nothing else on their plates?
DeleteWonder what they have in store for Father's Day?
DeleteToo OLD to be breastfeeding, and Tripp is WAY to old for a binky.
ReplyDeleteI have breastfed 3 kids. One for 9 months, one for 13 months, and one for 16 months. I think it is a very personal decision between mom and baby when to stop. However, this cover photo is horribly exploitative. I would hate to be this kid in a few years, when he realizes his mom used him in this way. Disgusting.
ReplyDeleteWhat can you expect from a magazine that featured $creech on the cover?
ReplyDeleteI haven't read a TIME article since...
DeleteA nursing mother is not available for continuing reproduction. Lactation is a natural contraceptive. Anyone interested in "natural" health issues and over-population might welcome nursing mothers who produce healthy children, if less numerous, children.
ReplyDeleteThe only problem here is contemporary male fixation on female breasts as personal sex toys.
lactation is NOT a fool proof method of birth control.
DeleteIt says: "Lactation is a natural contraceptive."
DeleteWhere do you get "fool proof"?
NO contraception is 100%. Our medical research hasn't moved past 1975. And not likely to, considering the present environment of this country. Just look at the presidential candidates.
My girl friend relied on "nature's contraceptive," while nursing her first borne child. Her kids are 10 months apart.
DeleteI relied on OrthoNovum and then an IUD and got pregnant.
DeleteNothing is "fool proof"; nobody has ever said anything is.
Tori Spelling said it on the clip with Sarah Palin on the Today show.
DeleteTori WAS breastfeeding when she got pregnant AGAIN.
She should have used an aspirin 'tween her knees.
I got pregnant while I was nursing my 7th month old. It is NOT a fool proof contraception method fer sure!
DeleteAll you people with all your self-righteous opinions about the rights and wrongs (child abuse?!) of breastfeeding toddlers! Give it a break, there are more important things in the world to worry about. I'm sure this woman has done her research and has very good reasons for breastfeeding her toddler.
ReplyDeleteThe tacky part of this magazine cover is the unnatural way they are posed. Never in my almost 40 years of motherhood (and 4 children breasted till ages 2-3) have I ever seen a kid stand on a stool to breastfeed. In real life, Mom sits and takes kid on her lap. It's a restful, nurturing, and bonding time for both. The magazine intentionally posed them in a way that subtly suggested sexuality because they knew would stir up controversy. Anything to get attention and promotes sales, eh?
I breastfed my four children - in public as well as private. If someone couldn't deal with it I figured it was THEIR problem not mine. Our society needs to dump that puritanical heritage and get used to the sight of the female breast being used in a way that is not sexual.
Just my 2cents (from 40 years of experience)
Right on..... It's no wonder kids don't know how to nurture and love today. So many people are willing to take this most beneficial activity away from them in the name of modesty. Give me a break, indeed!
DeleteRick
Well said.
DeleteActually, I've seen toddlers and older kids come up to Mom and take the breast out themselves (Nat Geo-type specials). One kid came up and demanded milk, now! It feels wrong to me to have such a verbal interaction over Mother's milk, especially in this country.
DeleteWRT breastfeeding in public, I did it when necessary, tried to be as discreet as possible, and otherwise figured it was the other person's problem if they were offended.
Excellent Comment. Almost every other country, it's a natural and common thing to see women breastfeeding in public, openly and unashamed, as it's supposed to be.
DeleteA few that I visited have no problem with topless women by the sea or pool, but it's always at the woman's discretion.
Sorry, but the clip showed them in the natural cradling position, with him so big he was half way slipping off her lap.
DeleteStill unnatural.
It was said above. Teeth are nature's way of saying you're grown up enough to eat solid food.
Four years old is beyond unnatural. It borders on abuse.
Gryphen, I admire your candor, and I laugh with you, not at you.
ReplyDeleteIn today's "Removed from Nature" society, which for the most part does not connect meats, eggs and milk with their sources, breastfeeding does seem to shock many, when it should not. It is the natural and necessary way decreed by Nature to nourish a newborn, provide needed immune responses, and hormonally guide the mother's body back to a healthy non-pregnancy state of being, thus assuring fertility at a later date.
Fact of mammalian life! It should be honored and practiced if and when possible. That said, I am of the "be there when needed, step back when not" philosophy. That idea includes the tasks of weaning a toddler from the breast as well as encouraging sleeping alone, but being ready to take the child to the comforts of the parental bed when nightmares cause fears. In other words, being flexible in how to guide young ones onto their own independent paths is of the utmost importance.
Parental decision avoidance seems cowardly, self-indulgent and ultimately crippling for the offspring, because at some point the new generation shall be forced to deal with the joys as well as the vicissitudes of the greater society.
But that's just me, as usual coming at the discussion fromthediagonal.
I breastfed two. Encouraged my daughter-in-law to breastfeed my grandson.
DeleteShe didn't. She had attachment issues with the new baby, wasn't into it.
My sibling refused to breastfeed four. Fundamentalist Amway Christians. Not Godly. Sinful. Spoils the child. Ruins mom's breasts? Who knows.
Allergic to breastmilk, allergic to cow's milk, then allergic to soy, now allergic to literally everything. They carry Epi-Pens and are fearful of anaphylactic shock and impending death. [Even though they eat _everything_, ironically. Nobody died yet from boxes of Cheezits.]
They also used "BabyWise" parenting techniques, which means letting newborns cry for extended periods, withholding nutrition, hitting very young infants.
My kids are high-performing achievers. Athletic, functional, gracious, warm, compassionate and attractive.
Sibling's kids are uniformly dull, socially-awkward, unpleasant, dysfunctional, overweight and in poor health. Can't hold a conversation with anyone except themselves.
I dunno. I think breastfeeding takes it.
My children were exclusively formula fed, and I would describe them exactly the way you describe yours. Your ignorance and arrogance is repulsive.
DeleteAnd my experience is the polar opposite. My sibling breast fed her three until 2 to 3 years of age. All are allergic to damned near everything and are fat slobs who never went to college. I never did my one child and she's not allergic to anything, she' a triathlete and has two degrees (Criminal Justice and Psychology). It does not depend on what they eat but how you raise them. Kids raised on farms, like mine, and let outside a lot with pets have less chance of getting allergies.
DeleteAnonymous 12:59 PM - "Your ignorance and arrogance is repulsive."
DeleteYep, there ya go. Point made.
You must be super offended by this magazine cover. It must be the equivalent of porn to you, huh?
I might find YOUR arrogance and ignorance equally repulsive. If I actually knew you.
Anonymous 1:28 PM - "It does not depend on what they eat but how you raise them."
Your child not being allergic to anything says more about you and common sense applied, than it does about breastfeeding.
That's what I think too.
Ok, time out folks! As wonderful as breast milk is, we don't have to criticize someone else's decision to bottle feed. There are valid reasons for formula feeding. Some women can't produce enough milk, or have other valid personal reasons that should be respected and honored.
DeleteNot ALL bottle fed children get allergies, weakened immune systems, etc. Modern Formulas are just as good as breast milk.
How about women who adopt infants? Are THEY less of a mom just because they're not lactating? If a woman's job doesn't accommodate breast feeding, should she risk losing her job?
"Are You Mom Enough?" to accept other Mom's choices?
I was breast fed until I was 2. My brother, who is six years younger than me, could not be breast fed due to my moms horrible breast fever/rash. He is allergic to 34 things, tho some worse that others. I am not. My brother is book smart, he is in college to be an architect. I am not. I am creative. I am an artist. I can draw whatever I see, he can't draw a stick figure. But these are traits we inherited from our parents. My father was breast fed, and still allergic to the world, but he is incredibly smart, while my mother, who was also breast fed, is an incredibly talented painter.
DeleteI don't think whether or not we were breast fed had any effect on how we turned out, but more from the support from our parent to recognize our talents are nurture them from a young age.
You guys aren't using good reading comprehension skills. Who criticized someone else's decision to bottle-feed?
DeleteThe second comment is a rude knee-jerk reaction to the first comment, calling them "arrogant and repulsive."
My take is that is more likely about saying "Fundamentalist Amway Christians" and BabyWise parenting, than it is about breastfeeding decisions.
The commenter that says the other guy is repulsive, has gotta be a mom who didn't breastfeed because they think it's sinful.
Since reading the rest of the comments here, I have a better understanding of how prevalent this attitude is.
This was a good learning experience - I genuinely did not know that there's a pervasive vague discomfort that breastfeeding is some kind of sexual act on the mom's part.
See, even with this open-minded crowd, the childs age is a factor for some reason. I studied up on everything about good mothering, for my children (to-be)- who are now in their thirties.= I learned that the common denominator of LaLeche types was letting the child wean themselves. My 1st, 10 mos., 2nd- 18 mos (which is the average age), 3rd-18 mos (i had an all-consuming job, so i weaned him, turned him to a bottle, which i still have guilt about), 4th - 3 yrs. - In Biblical times, it is inferred that Isaac may have been 5 yrs. And other Biblical characters around 3 yrs. I read that indigenous cultures, wean at 3-5 yrs old. - The reason the West is so stunned by it, (as Jesse :-), is our constant fascination and sexualization of the breast.
ReplyDeleteThe problem with this Time cover is, it doesn't win people over to the idea. Too blatant.
Amazingly what some of the longterm of breastfeeding benefits are: less chance of orthodontics (mouth bones form better), less emotional problems for child, higher IQ, less chance of asthma, better health in general. - So, I suppose indigenous people w/o studying books and having to instinctively survive, had an inner-knowing that nursing longer had a better chance of creating a stronger individual.
I can vouch for this. My kids have beautiful straight teeth, no asthma, no physical ailments, honor students, reached genetic potential, imo, - I'm Japanese descent, emotionally stable, lots of friends, well-behaved when entering school, and great mother/child bond to this day. They are hard-working responsible parents.
I notice when I am around young nursing mothers these days, many of them must have learned about these benefits. Young people are aware that our civilization has given us many modern day maladies with over-processed foods, GMOs, pharmaceuticals.. and other stuff that comes from corporate greed, misinformation, and what is called "science".
oops, didn't elaborate on the Japanese part that i wrote about (above). statistically Japan scores high in longevity, good health, and well-adjusted people. yes, kids can be nourished with other foods and formula, but when you see toddlers eat a half of cup of this and a tablespoon of that, you know that all the food he/she can consume won't have all the nutrients required.
Deletesince i'm back on this topic. breastfeeding is good for the mother. they lose their added pregnancy weight! and there is an emotional attachment, that probably helps them to retain a bond with their children for the rest of their lives.
Thank you. Totally agree.
DeleteI breastfed my child. We pretty much weaned each other at almost 3. At that point he was eating food and was only using me as a comfort, a supplement. I'm not very big, so it was taking a toll on me, so we stopped.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I live in a native community. It is common to see women nursing until 5 or so. I've seen older toddlers come and push the baby off the breast so that they could get some of that. It is normal in that culture.
I chose to breastfeed for many reasons- Health of the baby. Because we couldn't afford formula. And because I didn't want to use a breast pump, and we live and work in a place where I could take my baby with me everywhere and nurse when needed.
But I remember taking a 1st class seat down to AZ to attend my brother's wedding with my son who was about 9 months at the time. I did my best to be discreet, cover up, etc. But you would have thought I had stripped down to a thong and pasties and set up a strip pole in the aisle of the plane with the dirty looks I got from this uptight asshole. The attendants actually made me move my seat because I was "offending" and "disturbing" the man next to me.
You know what Americans? You are embarrassing. We dress our young girls in sexually provocative clothing and makeup. We have porn-like shows on mainstream tv. We have shows that show violence and death in clear hi-def color and sound.
Yet the naked milk-filled breast is dirty?
This particular picture I think was staged for its shock value. They could have done this so much more "tastefully" - Ha! there's my pun for the morning.
But overall, get a grip people. I mean really.
I also breast fed one child (son) until nearly three years of age, but I'm an engineering professor at a small college. I don't think anyone knew, but then, it was none of their business. As you say, we just weaned each other, very slowly over a year or so, very painlessly. My other two (daughters) lost interest earlier- one at around 18 months and the other, at 12 months announced "nurtz is yuck." Now that hurt!
DeleteI think that group of women was sexually harassing you. Imagine the tables turned a bit, what it you were with a group of guys and one of them started peeing in front of one woman while they were discussing a childs reading scores. I mean penises are perfectly natural and every body pees right'?
ReplyDeleteOnce they figured you were embarrassed that should have been the end of the story. No further comment, and an agreement to talk when the mother was free to give her full attention to the conversation.
And that kid isn't four, he's nearly six. Time magazine is total trash-they might as well show her smacking him in the face. That is a NOT a healthy relationship--ask any psychologist.--she is fucking that kid up. And she is also vey sexualized. That tank top isn't about hot weather.
Get back on your meds and I'll schedule you a visit with your shrink. You are the one with major issues.
DeleteRick
Well, I am a psychologist. And, since you seem to be asking, there's not a single inappropriate thing about extended nursing. There's never been a shred of evidence to suggest that it harms children in any way. Quite the opposite actually, there is evidence dating back to antiquity to support a correlation between extended breastfeeding and the health - both mental and physical - of a child. This is not to suggest that formula fed children can't be just as healthy, it's simply to state that extended breastfeeding is beneficial.
Deletethe problem. the thing that will screw him up is the sexual nature of the image. That is not a normal woman nurturing a child. She is using him to express her sexuality. The fact that she dresses him up as a mini-man in his combat fatigues illustrates the problem.
DeleteAh yes, the whole breastfeeding debate that never goes away, making the mother feel that she is doing the wrong thing by feeding her child in the most natural and healthy way. Granted, this picture was staged to make a point, the article was about attachment parenting which I don't have a problem with seeing how one wants to have an attachment to their child, but did they have to show the kid standing to nurse? Really???
ReplyDeleteI used to get a lot of grief from my mother and other family members because I nursed way after a year and didn't have a problem nursing anywhere. I smile at younger moms and want to give them big thumbs up when i see them nursing because it is the best thing they could possibly do for their child. Seems like only here in America, there is a huge disconnect on what mammary glands are for in the first place. The longer we can nurse a child, the better off they are in the long run. The bonding becomes more important than actual food source. When I was nursing my second child, my son would ask for a turn even though he had been weaned for some time, he just wanted that connection for a minute and went on to play. I see nothing wrong with that.
I hope the woman in the picture will be alright. I wouldn't have agreed to go on Time magazine in the first place but that is just me, but I admire her courage. Weird that the more things change, the more they stay the same. 30 years ago, same discussion was being held about women breastfeeding,it makes some people really uncomfortable.
Gryphen, you really got to the heart of the problem with having a problem with open breastfeeding: people feel uncomfortable with it because they are identifying a naked breast with sex.
ReplyDeleteAnd who can blame them when we live in such a hypersexualized society, largely in the commercial arena? We've been conditioned all too well.
Like you, I've come to a much more in depth opinion on the Time Magazine woman. I think she's making a very needed point: the one thing we should not be sexualizing is a nursing mother, and by hiding breastfeeding like it's something that should be done furtively, we are, actually, sexualizing a nursing mother.
Kudos to your post.
Gryphen said
ReplyDelete"Well of course I had seen many, but I certainly did not expect to see hers, and I certainly not expected it to make an appearance during a conversation about gymnastics."
That's exactly the problem most women do not understand. When I breastfed, I tried to do it in private, if I couldn't, I would be discreet. But just because it's natural doesn't mean everyone needs to see it. Especially men. I also think the older the child, the more controversy it inspires. And shouldn't children with a full set of teeth be weaned??
I think the uncomfortable factor for me about the photo (as a mom) is that it is on the cover of a magazine. Of course it's going to shock a few people- even open-minded people, all for different reasons. For me, I think of what that child will have to go through in the way of teasing by peers, not because it's a "bad" thing, but kids will do that. I wouldn't put my kid through that if I didn't have to. I think the photo wasn't needed for the article.
On the other hand, if someone sees a breast feeding, big deal. But I really don't want to see a guy doing some of the things that are "natural" either!
Well I feel I should reiterate that the young mother WAS being very discreet. So discreet in fact that I had NO idea she was breastfeeding until the shawl she had draped over her slipped to the floor.
DeleteMy point was not that SHE did anything wrong, accidents happen, my point was that even somebody as used to being around babies, and young mothers, and breastfeeding as I was, could still be completely embarrassed by a truly normal and natural situation.
By the way moms had no problem with my reaction, in fact they found it quite hilarious, and teased me about it mercilessly for over a year.
Sometimes the kid's mothers could be quite flirtatious, which was another source of discomfort for me, and I think the fact that i was always trying to be so professional fed into what they found to be so humorous about my momentary lapse.
Be discreet, cover up....yes, most of us all tried to do so. But what about when the child doesn't want his head covered and rips the shawl off you? What about when you HAVE to feed your child and there IS NO other place to go? Why should we have to hide away to feed our children? Why should we feel ashamed or embarrassed to take care of this natural function?
DeleteNo, American society needs to get the stick out of its butt and learn how to have a healthy body image and that exposed skin is not all about sex.
I think your situation was hilarious and "cute". Tis true, it would make most men uncomfortable. And most mothers are discreet, that's why the Time cover was a stupid move.
DeleteYeah, exactly! Quit shoving your damned hand down your pants in public!
DeleteWe need an exaggerated photo shoot of THAT on the cover of TIME.
Teach your teenage boys not to handle themselves through their pants standing in the grocery store. It's disgusting and shocking.
Teach your boys not to adjust themselves when they stand up from the couch or the desk or whatever. Are they intentionally trying to get us to look at their schlongs?!
Lois on "Family Guy" has been breast-feeding Stewie for years.
DeleteUnder the newest law passed recently in Tennessee, this Mom could possibly be fined or go to jail for allowing the boy to engage in "gateway sexual activity".
ReplyDeleteAnd, in Tennessee, that particular cover could be found to be illegal:
Deletehttp://dregstudiosart.blogspot.com/2011/07/potentially-offensive-portrait-governor.html
An excerpt from the article dated July 23, 2011:
"As of July 1st, my home state has adopted Tennessee Code Title 39, Chapter 17, Part 3 which bans the transmission of “Potentially Offensive Images” via the internet. Governor Bill Haslam signed this bill into effect last month, making us the first state in the country to put forth such a measure which CLEARLY snubs The First Amendment and Freedom of Speech. Violators of this newly formed law are subject to misdemeanor charges and a conviction to serve up to one year in jail and pay a $2500 fine."
In Arizona gov Brewer is doing her best to see that there are more lactating mothers. At least their bosses can help because they will be able to keep a breast of their personal decisions.
Deletehttp://tinyurl.com/d9tepwc
"Extreme parenting and those that have the time to work." Juju Chang
http://tinyurl.com/8xzbbe8
(stay at home vs working moms)
Nice.
DeleteI think it's really and truly time for legislation on sanctioned castration for rapists. Wife-beaters should be caned.
Well, the only equivalent male issue I can think of, has to be asked.
ReplyDeleteJesse, are you circumcised? How do you feel about that?
I understand that men are worried about their baby boys "matching" them. Why would that be? Do men and their sons routinely stand together and compare penises? Are men really that shallow?
Women continue to elect to have their baby's genitalia painfully mutilated without the benefit of anesthesia, just hours after birth. Why would they do this?
I understand from my women friends that they choose to traumatize a tiny infant with a stunningly painful experience in the first few hours of life, rather than have them face painful teasing later in life. Like in the boys' locker room at school. Are women really that shallow and that obsessed with popularity?
Really? Do high school boys stare at each other's penises in the locker room? Wow, if my kid was being harassed when he was naked in a locker room, that would really be alarming to me. I'd get him out of that kind of pervy situation. Right away.
Do you think there's any correlation between this traumatic ritual of inflicting pain on a baby (on his penis!) and increasing rates of rape and sexual deviance in America? Child sexual assault?
Understand that the baby suffers tremendous pain for at least a week after. It hurts them to be handled, picked up, diaper changes. Any normal baby care activity is causing pain to the infant's genital region.
When the foreskin is removed, it desensitizes the penis, affecting sexual stimulation in adult men.
Do you think this causes men to need rougher, more aggressive sexual stimulation, leading to violent sexual acts?
Would you think this is the underlying cause of increasing sexual impairment and use of Viagra?
Let's put that on the cover of TIME Magazine. We'd all buy that issue, wouldn't we?
WTF?
DeleteI absolutely agree!! Circumcision is male genital mutilation, it's cruel and inhumane. The problem is society implies that foreskin is dirty and will lead to infections!! Your right, why doesn't Time do an article about that!!
DeletePermit me to answer for Jesse: it's personal and none of your damned business.
DeleteAfter reading the rest of your post, I think you have some rather wild ideas and/or issues and are over-thinking the entire thing.
"I think you have some rather wild ideas and/or issues and are over-thinking the entire thing."
DeletePerfect. You got the point.
Nursing a baby is a mammalian response. No need to overthink it.
It's not sex.
It never was.
It never will be, except in porn flick storylines.
Contrary to male imagination, mothers get no sexual gratification.
It's part of femaleness that men will never experience themselves.
Nobody seems to be considering the father's viewpoint. I think nursing such an old child, especially a boy, is a way to maintain a distance from the father. It does not seem to be a natural way to give the child independence. I once counseled a woman who complained that her husband wanted her to stop breastfeeding her toddler. The boy was one of those cuddlers whose hands were all over her. I could understand the father's feelings.
ReplyDeleteI understand psychological/emotional dependence on others - moms dependent on kids.
DeleteI think Sarah Palin suffers from this. She can't go anywhere or do anything without Piper.
I'm guessing that's what you're referring to, but not clear.
There's mothering and children - bonds, attachment, the natural dependence of an infant versus the independence of an older child, etc.
Then there's adult relationships. Husband and wife - bonding, attachment, emotional dependence, partnership, communication, goals, etc. And sex. Sexual attraction, affection manifested physically, the expression of love through adult play (slapping butts, admiring/touching boobs, whatever).
I do not understand this father's feelings. He's confusing baby's non-sexual touch of its mother with its hands, with adult sexual gestures of touch. VERY different touching!
Oedipus. Dad's transferring sexual jealousy.
Would he feel the same way about a girl child, I wonder?
I don't think the father would feel the same way about a girl. I think I suggested that she not feed the child in front of the father. He had accepted this for over a year, but now was uneasy about it. I had no idea what the dynamics were between them, only the mother's report. It was not necessary for the nutritional health of the child, and that was what I was counseling her for. It would take a family counselor to untangle this further.
DeleteI agree. There is something wrong with the sexual attitude displayed by this woman and by this picture.
DeleteAnd as I said before, the group of women "teasing" gryphon were sexually harassing him. Absolutely the same as a group of creepy guys at an office expecting women to just laugh off lewd remarks.
I can tell what's wrong with the Time Magazine cover. There is no intimacy. The kid could just as easily been sucking milk through a straw from a glass.
ReplyDeleteWhen women nurse their babies, most of them hold the child close. In addition to nutrition, there is all of that bonding, mom smiling at baby, touching baby's cheek, holding baby's little hand. Yes, there are exceptions. As the child gets older, there is still that intimacy as mom puts her arm around the child. I know that the cover photo was posed, but it was posed to show an emotional distance rather than a closeness between mother and child.
A friend of mine felt she had breast fed a bit too long for her youngest. She finally cut her daughter off when she was able to politely form complete, grammatically correct requests to eat.
ReplyDeleteI'm a woman and I think the magazine cover is totally inappropriate. Nursing an infant discreetly is one thing and a good thing at that. That photo makes a mockery of breastfeeding.
ReplyDeleteI nursed my 3 kiddos, and plan on nursing the one I am expecting, and yeah, it was disturbing. To me, there comes a time when you just got to stop. For my youngest it was 13 months. He had teeth, was walking and talking, and just growing more independent, and dammit, I wanted my boobs back! He's four now, and I can't imagine still nursing him! Oh, and I'm a "real mom"!
ReplyDeleteWouldn't need a stool if breastfeeding that long. Overworked titties would hang down below the waist.
ReplyDeleteThere is that concern as well as often times reparative surgery can be required to tighten the breast tissue after subsequent longterm breastfeedings. I guess that's a small price to pay for the bonding that is inherent in the process, and hey, modern medicine can work miracles and fix that which is saggy!
DeleteThat is exactly what I thought. Who is she trying to kid? She hasn't heavy breasts full of milk. She isn't wearing a bra and her breasts look far too perky for someone who has been breastfeeding for three years.
DeleteI have breastfed all of my children, and I am firm advocate of giving your baby the best start in life. Having said that, I liked to be discreet about it.
And yes, breast feeding is about bonding. There is no bonding going on in that picture.
What I find appalling is how judgemental many Americans are about nearly anything, compared to other cultures.
ReplyDeleteWe get all up on our high horse about whatever (sex, kid raising, politics, contraception, religion, drugs, fashion,) and insist that everyone else is wrong, and deserves to be ostracized, punished or even jailed.
I wonder if it's attributable to the hard core Christian /Catholic legacsy, or just an embedded cultural baseline unique to the USA.
Bottom line: If my neighbor breast feeds til the kids are 7, or smokes pot, or loves a same gender person, how does that possibly harm me?
Live and let live.
Right on, A.J. -- I agree with you. :o)
DeleteI could care less how long someone breast feeds their child. But I am disgusted that this women has no clue about the internet and what torment that kid is going to suffer from classmates when they get that picture. Time for people to GROW UP and think about what they want their kid to have to handle in the future. Why lay land mines for the kid's future when a tiny, itsy-bitsy use of BRAIN would tell you the kid is NOT going to like hearing about this picture every day in 4th, 7th, 9th grade and on into college.
ReplyDeletePerfect. That's how I feel.
ReplyDeleteThis was a response to A.J. Billings. I DO NOT feel the same as the comment above.
DeleteSure, the teasing is surely going to become tiresome for this little boy.
But he's a guy. An American. All of his friends are going to be giving him that ol' wink-and-a-nod business.
Ultimately it's not going to harm him a bit. It's gonna make him quite studley in the eyes of his teenage peers.
And the little boy has a daddy, doesn't he? Don't you think Dad had a say in this photo shoot?
It's not just what his mother (a woman) inflicted on him.
"But he's a guy. An American."
Deleteirrelevant!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"And the little boy has a daddy, doesn't he?"
Well, being human, ya know, kinda implies the existence of a daddy. No matter how enthusiastic daddy may (or may not) have been about this photo plastered on a magazine, it was his MOTHER that supplied the boob.
No, they are not going to give him the wink and nod, they are going to call him a baby for sucking on his mom's boobs when he is more than able to feed himself (be independent).
DeleteNot a bit irrelevant that he's American.
DeleteAmerican culture varies from European, Australian, New Zealand, Asia, Africa, the Middle East, yadda yadda. Right?
This is ABOUT culture. Perception. Social mores.
OH, NOW I understand. You think it's because the boy is American that he won't be teased/tormented with that picture by internet-wise class mates as he grows up through school and college.
DeleteOk, I'm game. WHY?
G., The next time you strip off your shirt on a hot day with a cheerful "oh that breeze feels good", please remember that females in this country never get that pleasure. Every since starting my 8 year-old summer imprisoned in fabric to satisfy some STUPID taboo, I have resented males' freedom. AND, to top it off (chuckle), there are plenty of fat men/boys with breast one heck of a lot bigger breasts than my inoffensive pair.
ReplyDeleteWhen the talk turns to burkqas and my liberal friends are all saying how dreadful to force women to hide themselves, I cheerfully interject a "well, when I can walk down the street topless like any guy can, then we'll know there's actually equality in this country". People really don't like to be reminded about how UNequally I am forced to dress. It's like I something radical or something.
In the '60s I was optimistic, but now it looks like I'll be dead before women are free.
Kauai is full of private clothing-optional beaches! One can still exercise a clothing free existence in the presence of other like minded individuals.
DeleteIn the 70's we had a "farm" on a hill with a long dirt road. Very private. I mentioned to my husband that I enjoyed gardening without a shirt on. He insisted that I not do that, even when I was home alone. I never understood that.
DeleteNice suggestion, like it. :)
DeleteBut it's not about finding a place where one can safely take a shirt off in privacy.
It's about our society and the norm that says that some 8-year-olds on a hot summer day can take their shirt off and some can't.
If you cut your 8-year-old girl's hair like a boy, dress her from head-to-toe in boy's clothing including shoes, there would be nothing shocking or even noticeable about the little BOY taking his shirt off to play in the sprinkler.
These are personal, not ideological, decisions. Every child is different; every parent is different. Obviously, the photo was staged for the purpose of generating maximum controversy and selling more magazines. Looks like it worked.
ReplyDeleteI liked breast feeding my son. He became disinterested at around 6 months....kinda sad for me.
ReplyDeleteIf you had the time, ask yourself if you would embrace the whole earth mother experience and take your spouse along with you. I'd do it again in a heartbeat....and yes, I breast fed in public but you couldn't tell.
I had an acquaintance who breast fed her child up to her 5th year....and thought nothing of it. I don't care....it's a personal thing.
Happy Mothers Day!
I nursed my first till she was just under 2 1/2- I was pregnant with my twins, and it became physically & mentally irritating ( lactation consultant said this was not at all unusual). I think most people look at the size of the child and react, forgetting that a three year old is still a pretty small child. Always a dear, vulnerable tot to mom, regardless of age.
ReplyDeleteIt is worth remembering the the World Health Organization recommends breastfeeding (supplementally, not exclusively) till age four, and with most nursing toddlers, this is the case. It is 1-3 times a day, not every two to four hours. Toddlers are busy, curious little creatures, and most wouldn't stand (sit) for frequent nursings. Additionally, the want to "do it myself!", and this extends to feeding themselves their favorite foods, which they will vociferously choose.
Be kind. It's Mother's Day.
The recommendations for third world countries are to protect the child by nutrition and sanitary feeding. Also there is the advantage of birth spacing. I don't think there is any reason to think that is recommended for first world countries.
DeleteYes, women should be able to raise their children as they see fit.
ReplyDeleteBut there are a few women whose treatment of their children is abnormal. There are those rare women who sleep with their sons. There are the rare women who starve their children, or feed them so much that toddlers are morbidly obese.
Sorry, but four years old is WAAAAY too old for breast feeding. I will go so far as to say this woman is getting sexual gratification from her son breast feeding. That is aberrant behavior. If she doesn't stop breastfeeding him soon it could be considered a form of child abuse.
And that right there is the problem - people confuse breastfeeding with sex.
DeleteEquating breast feeding in any way with child mistreatment or incest is very strange. Don't know what would would make you equate in your mind any sort of child abuse with breast feeding but I guess all of our minds work in different ways.
DeleteIn you opinion 4 years is "waaaay to old for breastfeeding" but standard medical opinion does not share that view. Perhaps you are misconstruing the sexuality of the female breast with the intended purpose of the gland for providing nutrients to infants and children?
While breast feeding is a pleasurable experience for the mother, producing relaxing hormones and endorphins, being that the breast is a very sensitive body part, the act of breast feeding provides a different pleasure than having breasts fondled by a sexual partner: our bodies recognize physical context and react appropriately. Besides, if breast feeding was not a pleasurable experience for the mother then no mother would do it. If sex didn't feel good then no one would procreate. Our bodies are hardwired for continuing and nurturing our species, as are the bodies of other animals.
You are aberrant to even think that!
Deletekiddie porn
ReplyDeleteMy first thought too, but that's because I deal with ChoMos (child molesters) all the time. Monday at the parole office is going to be a pain in the ass due to this cover. All the freaks (and yes they ARE freaks) are going to go ape shit over this damned thing....
DeletePhoto shoot. Glossy magazine cover. Shock factor. Being 'edgy'.
DeleteI completely agree 11:45. the issue isn't breast feeding, its inappropriate behavior with a child who needs to understand boundaries between adult behavior and child behavior.
DeleteWhat is irrelevant is the Brancy blog, can they ever take on anything as bold as the mother who posed for Time magazine? Shouldn't someone claiming that being a mother and from a so-called political family take on some real current issues? Why so uncaring for humanity and most of all women?
ReplyDelete"Well, there’s been a lot of action on my blog this week! I welcome all my new readers… even you guys who don’t agree with me on my recent post. Today, I’m posting something uplifting… something we can all agree on." The Brancy blog.
Brancy. They are all about unity and "for not aborting Christian in utero" Brancy, who can you abort in utero?
I have to laugh. I sat in a four-hour meeting with my boss (while still on maternity leave) with my baby, nursed her twice. Finally the boss says, "Aren't you going to feed that kid?" (His wife had breastfed two babes, so I assumed he was used to it.) I realized then that most people don't notice and don't know what's going on.
ReplyDeleteMy dad had taken about a thousand pictures of me breastfeeding my first one. He never got a revealing shot.
I breastfed for four years.
At what age does the child have to be before it goes from breastfeeding to child molestation? I mean think about it, he' s being asked by his mother to suck on her breasts at an age where his own sexuality is beginning to develop. This is abusive, and he's going to have issues with his sexuality in adulthood because of this behavior. Also, how would you like to be the person known for being the boy in that photo? A heavy burden to bear. Poor kid.
ReplyDeleteI second your opinion
DeleteI'm mom enough to know that that mother is sick.
ReplyDeleteThe most important point of breastfeeding my Asperger's Syndrome autistic child (complicated by epilepsy) until she was four years old, means the sustained skin-to-skin contact is probably the reason she is high functioning today.
ReplyDeleteOf course, there's minimal scientific evidence in the US for the benefits to special-needs infants of breastfeeding, because our puritanical background prohibits validating women, women who nurse, and especially women who nurse beyond the child's first year.
My parents tried to shame me about breastfeeding when I let my baby sleep with me. Mom said, "What, she'll still be sleeping with you at 16?" My defensive mode kicked in; I retorted, "At least she won't be sleeping with boys then!" Realization. Maybe I got promiscuous by the time I was 16 because I didn't have parental attachment.
ReplyDeleteSeriously, Queen Victoria screwed up the minds of many generations with her prudity. What is more natural than a mother feeding her baby? How did we get to a point that this activity is associated with sexuality and is to be scorned if done publicly. Many are making a big deal out of this because of the child's age, but in reality most who have a problem with it still would if the kid was 6 months. Get over it people, it's as natural as breathing. All babies should be fed whenever they want and in public if that's where they get hungry. If you can't deal with it, it's because you have a problem, not the mother. If you'd been breast fed longer, you wouldn't think anything of a boob.
ReplyDeleteWhat a screwed up society we live in.
Rick
Good point.
DeleteHistorically, Anglo-Saxons and the English breastfed for years. From a complete stranger. A wet nurse who was engaged to suckle the lord's baby.
Mortality of suckled infants in Britain,19%; for dry nursed infants it was 54%.
Sir Hans Sloan, 1660.
In 1753, the governor of the Vasa District in Sweden received permission for the King to fine those mothers who did not breastfeed.
Second-century AD Roman physician, Soranus of Epheses, criticized what was called "hand rearing" and admonished against the foolishness of beginning artificial feeding too early.
Moses had a wet nurse (Exodus 2:7-9).
And I, for suckling, no fix’d hour prescribe; This Nature teaches best the nursing tribe: Let her our mistress be; and when, with cries The hungry child demands his due supplies, Forbear not you the wish’d relief to bring; Nor then be loath your snowy breast to bare, That he may suck, and streaming fragrance share.
Scaevola de Sainte-Marthe (1536-1623)
Paedotrophiae. Paris, 1584,
A few comments mention that a child should be weaned once they have teeth, as if it's a natural sign. When a child is properly latched to the nipple, the teeth don't get involved at all. A child who still has an emotional need to nurse will not use his/her teeth because mom will yelp with pain and the nursing session will end. Obviously a child who bites the mom is done with nursing. I have three children. The first two nursed until four, and the third nursed until 4.5 years. After two or two and half years, the nursing was about comfort after an accident, or comfort for a few minutes at bedtime. They are healthy, well adjusted girls now. All three have high IQs. Does that have anything to do with nursing? I will never know. Perhaps the attachment parenting values helped reduce anxiety and enhanced learning.
ReplyDeleteBy the way, I used to attend a conservative church and I can tell you that those women rarely breastfed. But their teenage daughters tried to out-whore each other every Sunday morning with short skirts, cleavage, and tons of makeup. I wouldn't pose on a magazine cover as this woman did, but I certainly defend her right to expose North American hypocrisy when it comes to the overt sexualization of women and girls, and the ignorance about the real, natural needs of children.
I nursed my children until I returned to work (8 months to 1 year). Sadly pumping and/or having children in the workplace wasn't encouraged in the 80's so my milk dried up. I never felt comfortable breast feeding in public, even covered up. I remember nursing my infant son in the woman's stall in a public bathroom. How sad is that, and unhygienic too.
ReplyDeleteMy little sister nursed my niece until she was 3-4 years old. I think my niece did it for comfort, not nutrition.
On the flip side women are maid to feel like failures if they are unable to nurse their babies.
Although I don't like the TIme cover because it seems to sexualize and sensationalizes the nursing. I don't think women should have to hide with their babies to feed them. If they want to nurse their children until (whenever) and pull out their breasts in public, more power to them. I hate it that western culture has objectified women's breast to the point something as natural as feeding a baby becomes uncomfortable. Sadly we women feed right into it.
One things for sure, the Time cover has us talking about it.
You're right--women who can't nurse are made to feel like child-abusers from the "Mommier-than-thou" crowd.
DeleteI breastfed all 4 of my children. The first 3 until around 1 year of age. The youngest I ended up nursing until 3.5 years of age. I didn't plan it that way, it's just how it played out. After he was about 18 months old, the nursing was infrequent, and primarily for comfort or when he was sleepy. My husband encouraged it, and I couldn't have cared less what anyone else thought of it. I was discreet about it so as not to offend/embarrass anyone else in public though.
ReplyDeleteThe Time cover in question is strictly meant to be controversial and to sell magazines. No one would nurse their child the way it is portrayed in the picture.
I think the most offensive part of this whole thing is the "Are you mom enough?" bullshit. Our jobs as moms are to nurture our children to the best of our ability. If that means a mom chooses (or is unable to) breastfeed, that does not make her any less of a mom because she uses formula instead. People need to stop trying to turn women against one another. Whether it be breastfeeding/non-breastfeeding or working moms/stay at home moms, the War on Women needs to stop, and it's up to us women to stop it.
I breast fed both daughters and have no problem with breast feeding in public. However, the attachment bond theory that this mom professes to follow makes me a little uncomfortable. Have there been any long-term studies on the psychological effects in children who experienced attachment bond behavior like extended breast feeding or sleeping in their parents' bed? I think my discomfort comes down to whether or not this little boy will be able to separate and meet life's challenges on his own without having to contact his mother first.
ReplyDeleteIn another interview, the child was described as "whiny" because he wasn't getting his mother's undivided attention. That tells a lot.
Deletethen I guess it's ok to publish pics of a milf breastfeeding her 16 y/o son too
ReplyDeleteperfectly natural
Granted this Time Magazine cover was for controversial purposes, however, you kind of miss the point regarding the difference between breastfeeding children, even up to 5-6 years of age, and an incestuous relationship between mother and teen child. If that is your "fap material" you go with it, but really, you should keep your fantasies to yourself. Perhaps your unhealthy attitude towards sex is because you WEREN'T breastfed? As an armchair psychologist, that what I'm thinking ;-)
Delete"then I guess it's ok to publish pics of a milf breastfeeding her 16 y/o son"
DeleteHow the hell did you get there?!
See? The act of nursing a baby is viewed by some part of American culture as a perverted sexual thing and completely confused with deviant sex.
Wow! I get it now! _That's_ why a bunch of moms don't want to breastfeed!
Who knew?
I guess TIME isn't so stupid and pandering, after all. Apparently there is a need for discussion.
There's nothing wrong with breastfeeding appropriately.
ReplyDeleteHowever, this "new trend" of "attachment parenting" is being promoted by an evangelical pediatrician, William Sears, and the magazine's inside cover was allegedly about "attachment parenting." Obviously, Ms. Grumet has an affluent enough lifestyle to follow this guy's advice and doesn't have to work for a living, like 70% of the mothers in this country.
This immature 26 yr old's in-your-face cover which garnered her her 15 minutes of fame, in which she looks defiant and has a "fuck you if you don't like it" attitude, is insulting to all women, esp with the caption, "Are you mom enough?"
The ways these people stealthily insult the working mothers of this country makes me sick to my stomach. Women have enough with which to contend without having their mothering skills seen as inadequate in a national magazine.
I'm furious about it.
Good point; the evangelical crowd wants their women helpless and completely at the mercy of the man in their life--father, husband, whatever. By demanding that the woman be chained to the child for 3, 4, 5, 6, 8, 10 years breastfeeding on demand, that guarantees the woman won't be able to do anything else with her life but attachment parent.
DeleteThen, when hubby decides he wants a newer, less-exhausted model, mommy is out on her ear with no way to support herself because she's been a dependent all her life.
Lucky damn baby.
ReplyDeleteIf a child is old enough to demand or "ask" for breast feeding it is TOO old to do it. I haven't read the comments, too many, but I have seen this sort of thing up close and in person and I can tell you it was stomach turning to watch a child flip up his mothers blouse demanding "mommy juice"
ReplyDeletePerhaps that is where men become obsessed with breasts... breast fed too long, breast fed at all I don't know... but JEEZE, the obsession with breasts is creepy, young or not.
I think the embarrassment seeing a mother breast feed an appropriately aged child comes from the Puritans who dominated religion way back when. Breast feeding shouldn't be embarrassing for anyone unless it is age inappropriate, or is down right sexual in a public venue.
Every child is different and every mother is different. We all need to step back and relax and allow other parents to make the choices that work for their families. What works for you might not work for me and vice versa. We need to be much kinder to parents who are doing their best to raise their children well.
ReplyDeleteI am so tired of our society pitting working moms against stay at home moms and stay at home moms against working moms, breastfeeding moms vs bottle feeding moms - we should be supporting one another, not tearing each other down.
As for the magazine, they've got people talking and I'm sure they've sold a lot of magazines, so they've achieved their goal and let's face it, that's all they really care about.
SNL did a great job! Especially when he took the chair away.
ReplyDeleteThanks for sharing your embarrassment, but it's not your fault, Men are hardwired to focus on breasts. I breastfed my kids for eight months, only because I had the option at the time. I worked for a woman who had a lounge just for pumping and/or breastfeeding.
To be fair, the photo bothers me only because it's "posed", what offends me deeply, is "Are You Mom Enough?" Yes, it has health benefits for the child, increased immunity, bonding, fewer allergies, etc.
BUT, some women can't breastfeed or choose not to for other reasons (adoption, inability to produce enough milk, etc) it doesn't make them less of a mother. We have to respect women's situations and women's choices and not "value" them on a natural functions of a mother, to love, bond with, cherish, provide security and nurture her child to the best of her ability.
Happy Mother's day to all moms. And that includes anyone who's interacted in a meaningful way with a child. If you've cared for a pet, returned a fallen bird from a nest, or swerved to not hit a living creature, consider yourself a "Mom".
It takes a villiage
Threatened? I didn't see that. I saw criticism.
ReplyDeleteBTW, one of the best mothers I ever knew was my late aunt, who never had a child of her own but had an open heart for any child and who helped me with my own.
No "theory" of parenting, feeding or experimenting with child rearing can compete with ensuring a loving commitment to another human being and raising them to be a thinking, loving and independent human who is armed with the skills to make it in life on his or her own.