Morality is not determined by the church you attend nor the faith you embrace. It is determined by the quality of your character and the positive impact you have on those you meet along your journey
Thursday, June 28, 2012
How We Found Out.
I am not a fan of Dave Weigel as a rule, but THIS was certainly worth sharing.
Calling this a "tax" is just semantics... it is a penalty, and one imposed on those who can least afford it. It's like telling the homeless guy sleeping in a cardboard box under an overpass that he will have to pay a "tax" to sleep there, or telling the homeless lady pushing all her worldly belongings down the sidewalk in a filched shopping cart that she is required to pay a toll to continue. DUH.
I am and will continue to be an Obama supporter, but this bill is just WRONG.
The problem isn't lack of insurance coverage, the CORE of this issue which I hear NO-ONE addressing is what is costs to go to a "doctors" office or to a hospital. It is the cost of health CARE that is the root of this problem. If it was affordable to attain medical attention and care we wouldn't need the vultures in the health insurance business.
Why are doctors allowed to rape us financially? And on top of that being "raped" again by Insurance companies that deny coverage after you have PAID AND PAID AND PAID??????
And before I hear a defense about their [doctors']scholastic bills, let me ask you if you know a POOR doctor???? Medical students are in it for the MONEY honey, the hypocritical, UM hippocratic oath went by the wayside eons ago.
Doctors and hospitals and the outrageous amounts of money they charge for ~health care~ are soooo out of line and are the root of the un-affordable health care problem in this country.
EFF the ACA, put me in jail because I will not pay the "tax" penalty, I'll get FREE "health care" in jail.
I like Obama but HATE this bill. Never thought I;d side with the rethugs, BUT, just sayin right is right and WRONG is wrong. This bill is WRONG>
Liz, I hear what you are saying but I believe you are incorrect. There is a waiver for people who can't afford it.
Right now when you turn 65 and you don't take Medicare, you will be charged a penalty when you do take it. It's not financially done the same way but it is no different.
The purpose of the mandate is to get the healthy younger people insurance. This pays for the other things provided in the bill.
I prefer a Medicare for all option but I do think it will happen. Why? Because some/much of the expansion of coverage is done through Medicaid, at the state level. It's not going to work - wait and see. And that's because we have moron RW governors like Jan Brewer or others.
I have no trouble with a mandate. Every country with universal coverage has a mandate.
@Liz 323PM You've raised some interesting and some valid points. No question, the bill is flawed. It was cobbled together crudely with undue influence from greedy lobbyists and dishonest power hungry partisan politicians. But please consider the following:
1) it's unlikely any society will ever provide 100% on-demand, state-of-the-art universal health care provided by the practitioner of your own choice at modest cost. No one does it now. So there are always compromises and trade-offs.
2) What Obamacare does is to establish the principle that access to health care in this country shouldn't be limited exclusively to the wealthy or those who happen to be well employed when they get sick or are injured. We're the only developed country that doesnt already operate under that principle and only the uninformed or outright liars will claim that the US health care system is the best in the world.
3) Many adjustments will have to be made in the future. The ACA was just the beginning. It will get better. And the issues of costs, access, allocation, etc should be debated vigorously but without the distraction of outright lies such as Sarah Palin's Patented Death Panels.
4) Eventually we'll need to stop diverting $100s of billions in annual 'health care funds' to provide unnecessary insurance services and insurance company profits.
5) It would have been a lot simpler if they had said upfront: "There will be a health care tax which you can reduce to the extent you pay for insurance yourself or receive health insurance benefits at work." I suppose this would have been similar to the "Medicare for all" option. It was never a good idea to call the payment a penalty.
6) Most Americans approve of the goals of Obamacare and most of the major provisions. They universally dislike being forced to pay for those benefits. They would probably say the same thing today if asked to pay taxes to build the interstate highway system or buy Alaska from the Russians. They'll adjust.
Even tho the health care system in 2024 will probably not look much like what it does in 2014, we'll all have President Obama to thank that it doesnt look like what it did in 2008. Be patient, vote for President Obama's re-election and watch how things get better.
And to Millard Rmoney I say proudly, "Hey, douchebag, keep yer damn mitts off my Obamacare!"
Poor people will get Medicaid. Medicaid will be expanded to 138% of poverty level and anyone: singles, families, anyone. Yes, I want single payer, but right now, this is the best we can do. People will be covered; people can't be refused; people can't be dropped. That is a start. If we can get a Democratic Congress, maybe we can get single payer. Don't forget big health care was paying lobbyists over $1million/ day to kill what little we did get.
Thank you, Mr. Conehead, Esquire! Brilliant diagnoses. Perhaps, though, in hindsight, it might have been best to pass on Alaska....not sure, but maybe Texas also too. Oh, heck, toss in Florida and the rest of the Louisiana purchase....
"Through interviews with former employees and members of Congress, as well as extensive document searches, ABC News has learned new details about the services offered by the Office of Attending Physician to members of Congress over the past few years, from regular visits by a consulting chiropractor to on-site physical therapy.
"A member walked in and was generally walked right back into a physician’s office. They get good care. They are not rushed. They are examined thoroughly," said Eduardo Balbona, an internist in Jacksonville, Fa., who worked as a staff physician in the OAP from 1993 to 1995.
"You have time to spend to get to know your patients and think about them and really think about how you preserve their health going forward," Balbona said. "We’re not there to put on Band-Aids. We were there to make sure that everything possible that could be done [is done] to preserve that member of Congress."
Services offered by the Office of the Attending Physician include physicals and routine examinations, on-site X-rays and lab work, physical therapy and referrals to medical specialists from military hospitals and private medical practices. According to congressional budget records, the office is staffed by at least four Navy doctors as well as at least a dozen medical and X-ray technicians, nurses and a pharmacist.
Sources said when specialists are needed, they are brought to the Capitol, often at no charge to members of Congress.
"If you had, for example, prostate cancer, you would go to one of the centers of excellence for the country, which would be Johns Hopkins. If you had coronary artery disease, we would engage specialists at the Cleveland Clinic. You would go to the best care in the country. And, for the most part, nobody asked what your insurance was," Balbona said.
In addition to Balbona, several former staff members and private physicians who have consulted at the OAP as recently as last year agreed to talk to ABC News on background. They described a culture centered on meeting the needs and whims of members of Congress, with almost no concern for cost.
Members of Congress do not pay for the individual services they receive at the OAP, nor do they submit claims through their federal employee health insurance policies. Instead, members pay a flat, annual fee of $503 for all the care they receive. The rest of the cost of their care, sources said, is subsidized by taxpayers. And some of the members don't even pay the fee. Feel the outrage."
I have to suppress the urge to gloat(I tell myself I am better than that). I'll do little happy dances instead. There is still plenty of work to do to make it better but this is a great start.
Love, love, love Ms. Matfess's joy at the news. So many others will share in this joy that they will be able to live a life with lots less pain now that they will be able to have insurance to defray the cost of medical care.
Thanks President Obama for starting the long process to single payer :)
I felt just like that young woman when I heard the news... my husband and I were hooting and hollering like kids. No more being turned down for insurance or receiving second rate care for my son who has ulcerative colitis.
I know there are millions of stories out there like ours. Thank you President Obama and Chief Justice Roberts.
Yes there are many stories out there 3:56 PM - so many people have diseases like MS, Parkinsons, etc. and the insurance companies cannot stop coverage due to having a pre existing condition. Thank God and thank you my favorite president in the world - President Obama and a special thank you to Chief Justice Roberts!
And, fuck you Republicans!!! Vote them DOWN in the next election cycle voters - it is most important they are drummed out on all levels of government - Congress - state and local.
My dad had a heart attack in 2009, and has had a couple more stents placed since then. He eats an extremely reduced saturated fat diet, exercises 1 hr/4 times a week (basically, does everything he's 'supposed' to), but he still has blockages- the dr says it's genetic. He was (and is) employed at a company that has great benefits- was out for 5 weeks after his heart attack and never missed a full paycheck, insurance covered a lot of the charges, etc- but I am rejoicing at this bill because of the WHAT IF for him- WHAT IF he gets laid off/his company closes, and he no longer has those benefits? We can't all have the "It's a good thing I have this," or the popular, "I've got mine, screw you" attitude- even if you're sitting pretty right now, you never know what might happen.
I got the news from you, Gryphen. My husband was looking at his iPad and had just said that the decision went the wrong way. How happy are we!!!! Hopefully when the exchanges are in effect our son will be able to get affordable insurance for himself and his kids. So many Americans are helped by this law. If only the stupid Republicans and Catholic prelates had cared about the people and not the politics it all would have gone so smoothly. I am so proud of President Obama at this moment! Obama-Biden-Democratic Congress 2012 Beaglemom
OK peeps, I donated to Obama to show that I stand with the President in support of Affordable Health Care. By text message! (I love the digital world.)
It's going to take buckets of money this election. We have to counter the Republicans, the TeaBaggers and our corporate overlords (was there ever a more misleading name than "Citizens United"?).
Let's GOTV and let's donate. If we all give small amounts we'll have a huge impact.
Liz 3:23. The homeless will not pay a penalty ("tax") for they have no means to pay. In the future they won't hang out in a hospital bed as full charity cases while housing is located for them and benefits filed for and the cost for their care or non medical extended stays paid by others.
It may not be well known that hospital corporations demanded doctors sell them their practices or they would not be allowed to practice at their hospitals. Corporations wanted to profit from private practices. Corporations make deals with insurance companies dictating you go to their facility for procedures instead of your doctor's office at a much lower cost.
My point is that some people made mega millions and billions driven by greed at the expense of others including firing staff slashing payrolls not giving a shit about humans. Our society worships money and those with the most money. I see admiration for enormous wealth, reverance, then displaced anger as is someone else fired people, added to unemployment who had nothing to do with it.
I suggest your frustration and ire might be better served aimed at corporations.
When I am online and feel an earthquake, I usually go to the local online papers plus USGS to see who will report it first, and then of course to learn the epicenter and magnitude. I have to say being only 7 min behind Bloomberg is quite a feat! I heard it first from you, and you clearly had something set up and ready to go, needing only tweaking to match this amazing and unexpected decision.
Just another Bravo! for you. Bravo to the "I have Lupus!" person, too.
So: first we donate, and next let's figger out how to reveal the Palin Hoax, so we can silence that woman who dares call anyone but herself a liar. And silence her pals, too. Or at least ramp their forthcoming dirty election tricks down a little.
Her reaction was absolutely beautiful. Witnessing history being made for the right reason is awesome. Once again, while everyone else is focusing on a pixel, President Obama is focused on the big picture.
I hear democrats complaining and whining, but the afa is light years ahead of the GOP's "Die Faster" plan.
Did anyone see Lego FLAT hair and fake curls on Greta this eve? Why they have this loser/quitter time and time on Fox fails me. Her lips are getting weird and so his her language for she seems to hanging around with teens 24/7!!!!
That, I say, is perhaps the most genuine and undeniable expression of need, thanks, and relief one can imagine and appreciate.
ReplyDeleteWell done, Mr. Obama!
Obama/Biden 2012
That made my eyes watery.
ReplyDeleteJust e-mailed you a great photo of Pelosi and Boehner at the moment they got the news.
ReplyDelete(No need to post...just knew you would want it.)
Actually, that photo was taken the day before the announcement but it does seem to represent their feelings about the actual announcement.
DeleteCalling this a "tax" is just semantics... it is a penalty, and one imposed on those who can least afford it. It's like telling the homeless guy sleeping in a cardboard box under an overpass that he will have to pay a "tax" to sleep there, or telling the homeless lady pushing all her worldly belongings down the sidewalk in a filched shopping cart that she is required to pay a toll to continue. DUH.
ReplyDeleteI am and will continue to be an Obama supporter, but this bill is just WRONG.
The problem isn't lack of insurance coverage, the CORE of this issue which I hear NO-ONE addressing is what is costs to go to a "doctors" office or to a hospital. It is the cost of health CARE that is the root of this problem. If it was affordable to attain medical attention and care we wouldn't need the vultures in the health insurance business.
Why are doctors allowed to rape us financially? And on top of that being "raped" again by Insurance companies that deny coverage after you have PAID AND PAID AND PAID??????
And before I hear a defense about their [doctors']scholastic bills, let me ask you if you know a POOR doctor???? Medical students are in it for the MONEY honey, the hypocritical, UM hippocratic oath went by the wayside eons ago.
Doctors and hospitals and the outrageous amounts of money they charge for ~health care~ are soooo out of line and are the root of the un-affordable health care problem in this country.
EFF the ACA, put me in jail because I will not pay the "tax" penalty, I'll get FREE "health care" in jail.
I like Obama but HATE this bill. Never thought I;d side with the rethugs, BUT, just sayin right is right and WRONG is wrong. This bill is WRONG>
30 million more Americans will have health coverage.
DeleteThat is not "wrong."
I cried tears of joy at the decision.
Liz, I hear what you are saying but I believe you are incorrect. There is a waiver for people who can't afford it.
DeleteRight now when you turn 65 and you don't take Medicare, you will be charged a penalty when you do take it. It's not financially done the same way but it is no different.
The purpose of the mandate is to get the healthy younger people insurance. This pays for the other things provided in the bill.
I prefer a Medicare for all option but I do think it will happen. Why? Because some/much of the expansion of coverage is done through Medicaid, at the state level. It's not going to work - wait and see. And that's because we have moron RW governors like Jan Brewer or others.
I have no trouble with a mandate. Every country with universal coverage has a mandate.
@Liz 323PM
DeleteYou've raised some interesting and some valid points. No question, the bill is flawed. It was cobbled together crudely with undue influence from greedy lobbyists and dishonest power hungry partisan politicians. But please consider the following:
1) it's unlikely any society will ever provide 100% on-demand, state-of-the-art universal health care provided by the practitioner of your own choice at modest cost. No one does it now. So there are always compromises and trade-offs.
2) What Obamacare does is to establish the principle that access to health care in this country shouldn't be limited exclusively to the wealthy or those who happen to be well employed when they get sick or are injured. We're the only developed country that doesnt already operate under that principle and only the uninformed or outright liars will claim that the US health care system is the best in the world.
3) Many adjustments will have to be made in the future. The ACA was just the beginning. It will get better. And the issues of costs, access, allocation, etc should be debated vigorously but without the distraction of outright lies such as Sarah Palin's Patented Death Panels.
4) Eventually we'll need to stop diverting $100s of billions in annual 'health care funds' to provide unnecessary insurance services and insurance company profits.
5) It would have been a lot simpler if they had said upfront: "There will be a health care tax which you can reduce to the extent you pay for insurance yourself or receive health insurance benefits at work." I suppose this would have been similar to the "Medicare for all" option. It was never a good idea to call the payment a penalty.
6) Most Americans approve of the goals of Obamacare and most of the major provisions. They universally dislike being forced to pay for those benefits. They would probably say the same thing today if asked to pay taxes to build the interstate highway system or buy Alaska from the Russians. They'll adjust.
Even tho the health care system in 2024 will probably not look much like what it does in 2014, we'll all have President Obama to thank that it doesnt look like what it did in 2008. Be patient, vote for President Obama's re-election and watch how things get better.
And to Millard Rmoney I say proudly, "Hey, douchebag, keep yer damn mitts off my Obamacare!"
Thank you Beldar for saying what rational people would like to say.
DeletePoor people will get Medicaid. Medicaid will be expanded to 138% of poverty level and anyone: singles, families, anyone. Yes, I want single payer, but right now, this is the best we can do. People will be covered; people can't be refused; people can't be dropped. That is a start. If we can get a Democratic Congress, maybe we can get single payer. Don't forget big health care was paying lobbyists over $1million/ day to kill what little we did get.
DeleteThank you, Mr. Conehead, Esquire! Brilliant diagnoses. Perhaps, though, in hindsight, it might have been best to pass on Alaska....not sure, but maybe Texas also too. Oh, heck, toss in Florida and the rest of the Louisiana purchase....
DeleteWild Tortoise
I want the health care plan our Congress people enjoy...
ReplyDeleteIt is my understanding it will work the same as their plans.
Deleteummmm, you like THIS. Somehow I don't THINK SO.
Delete"Through interviews with former employees and members of Congress, as well as extensive document searches, ABC News has learned new details about the services offered by the Office of Attending Physician to members of Congress over the past few years, from regular visits by a consulting chiropractor to on-site physical therapy.
"A member walked in and was generally walked right back into a physician’s office. They get good care. They are not rushed. They are examined thoroughly," said Eduardo Balbona, an internist in Jacksonville, Fa., who worked as a staff physician in the OAP from 1993 to 1995.
"You have time to spend to get to know your patients and think about them and really think about how you preserve their health going forward," Balbona said. "We’re not there to put on Band-Aids. We were there to make sure that everything possible that could be done [is done] to preserve that member of Congress."
Services offered by the Office of the Attending Physician include physicals and routine examinations, on-site X-rays and lab work, physical therapy and referrals to medical specialists from military hospitals and private medical practices. According to congressional budget records, the office is staffed by at least four Navy doctors as well as at least a dozen medical and X-ray technicians, nurses and a pharmacist.
Sources said when specialists are needed, they are brought to the Capitol, often at no charge to members of Congress.
"If you had, for example, prostate cancer, you would go to one of the centers of excellence for the country, which would be Johns Hopkins. If you had coronary artery disease, we would engage specialists at the Cleveland Clinic. You would go to the best care in the country. And, for the most part, nobody asked what your insurance was," Balbona said.
In addition to Balbona, several former staff members and private physicians who have consulted at the OAP as recently as last year agreed to talk to ABC News on background. They described a culture centered on meeting the needs and whims of members of Congress, with almost no concern for cost.
Members of Congress do not pay for the individual services they receive at the OAP, nor do they submit claims through their federal employee health insurance policies. Instead, members pay a flat, annual fee of $503 for all the care they receive. The rest of the cost of their care, sources said, is subsidized by taxpayers.
And some of the members don't even pay the fee. Feel the outrage."
I feel it and so should all of YOU.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfUtplm_QdU
DeleteDr Tim Johnson of ABC News interview
I have to suppress the urge to gloat(I tell myself I am better than that). I'll do little happy dances instead. There is still plenty of work to do to make it better but this is a great start.
ReplyDeleteLove, love, love Ms. Matfess's joy at the news. So many others will share in this joy that they will be able to live a life with lots less pain now that they will be able to have insurance to defray the cost of medical care.
ReplyDeleteThanks President Obama for starting the long process to single payer :)
Hoo-boy
ReplyDeleteWait till the judge hears Tank was running interference for Levi and giving bad advice on how to handle Tripp's mother.
Somebody has some explaining to do.
Will Levi actually show up for the hearing this time?
When is the hearing? Do you have a link?
DeleteTIA
*Alicat
I felt just like that young woman when I heard the news... my husband and I were hooting and hollering like kids. No more being turned down for insurance or receiving second rate care for my son who has ulcerative colitis.
ReplyDeleteI know there are millions of stories out there like ours. Thank you President Obama and Chief Justice Roberts.
Yes there are many stories out there 3:56 PM - so many people have diseases like MS, Parkinsons, etc. and the insurance companies cannot stop coverage due to having a pre existing condition. Thank God and thank you my favorite president in the world - President Obama and a special thank you to Chief Justice Roberts!
DeleteAnd, fuck you Republicans!!! Vote them DOWN in the next election cycle voters - it is most important they are drummed out on all levels of government - Congress - state and local.
OBAMA/BIDEN 2012
My dad had a heart attack in 2009, and has had a couple more stents placed since then. He eats an extremely reduced saturated fat diet, exercises 1 hr/4 times a week (basically, does everything he's 'supposed' to), but he still has blockages- the dr says it's genetic. He was (and is) employed at a company that has great benefits- was out for 5 weeks after his heart attack and never missed a full paycheck, insurance covered a lot of the charges, etc- but I am rejoicing at this bill because of the WHAT IF for him- WHAT IF he gets laid off/his company closes, and he no longer has those benefits? We can't all have the "It's a good thing I have this," or the popular, "I've got mine, screw you" attitude- even if you're sitting pretty right now, you never know what might happen.
DeleteI got the news from you, Gryphen. My husband was looking at his iPad and had just said that the decision went the wrong way. How happy are we!!!! Hopefully when the exchanges are in effect our son will be able to get affordable insurance for himself and his kids. So many Americans are helped by this law. If only the stupid Republicans and Catholic prelates had cared about the people and not the politics it all would have gone so smoothly. I am so proud of President Obama at this moment!
ReplyDeleteObama-Biden-Democratic Congress 2012
Beaglemom
Justice Roberts is looking at his legacy. Did he want to be the Chief Death Panalists, as the body count grew?
ReplyDeleteThe world sees Citizens United as a democracy destroyer. Does he want to keep that albatross around his neck?
It will be interesting to see if he begins to wind down Citizens United. Probably not but maybe.
OK peeps, I donated to Obama to show that I stand with the President in support of Affordable Health Care. By text message! (I love the digital world.)
ReplyDeleteIt's going to take buckets of money this election. We have to counter the Republicans, the TeaBaggers and our corporate overlords (was there ever a more misleading name than "Citizens United"?).
Let's GOTV and let's donate. If we all give small amounts we'll have a huge impact.
Sorry to be o/t but wanna know what's wrong with journalism today?
ReplyDelete"Mr McGinniss eggs him on with the kind of flagrantly leading question he seems to have habitually asked."
Good journalists and historians don't egg people on. This tactic creates more distortion and lies.
Liz 3:23. The homeless will not pay a penalty ("tax") for they have no means to pay. In the future they won't hang out in a hospital bed as full charity cases while housing is located for them and benefits filed for and the cost for their care or non medical extended stays paid by others.
ReplyDeleteIt may not be well known that hospital corporations demanded doctors sell them their practices or they would not be allowed to practice at their hospitals. Corporations wanted to profit from private practices. Corporations make deals with insurance companies dictating you go to their facility for procedures instead of your doctor's office at a much lower cost.
My point is that some people made mega millions and billions driven by greed at the expense of others
including firing staff slashing payrolls not giving a shit
about humans. Our society worships money and those
with the most money. I see admiration for enormous wealth, reverance, then displaced anger as is someone else fired people, added to unemployment who had nothing to do with it.
I suggest your frustration and ire might be better served aimed at corporations.
Mr G, I see your time stamp on this morning's SCOTUS news is 6:14, so that's 10:14 Wash DC time.
ReplyDeleteThis article says Bloomberg was the first at 10:07 with the accurate report (CNN and Fox being before that but hilariously wrong!). AP was 30 seconds later.
When I am online and feel an earthquake, I usually go to the local online papers plus USGS to see who will report it first, and then of course to learn the epicenter and magnitude. I have to say being only 7 min behind Bloomberg is quite a feat! I heard it first from you, and you clearly had something set up and ready to go, needing only tweaking to match this amazing and unexpected decision.
Just another Bravo! for you. Bravo to the "I have Lupus!" person, too.
So: first we donate, and next let's figger out how to reveal the Palin Hoax, so we can silence that woman who dares call anyone but herself a liar. And silence her pals, too. Or at least ramp their forthcoming dirty election tricks down a little.
Her reaction was absolutely beautiful. Witnessing history being made for the right reason is awesome.
ReplyDeleteOnce again, while everyone else is focusing on a pixel, President Obama is focused on the big picture.
I hear democrats complaining and whining, but the afa is light years ahead of the GOP's "Die Faster" plan.
Doing the happy dance for you all.
ReplyDeleteSlightly OT:
ReplyDeleteIn other news, the kids at Crazies4Palin have changed their site's background to black... I'm guessing to match their dear Leader sarah's soul.
Did anyone see Lego FLAT hair and fake curls on Greta this eve?
ReplyDeleteWhy they have this loser/quitter time and time on Fox fails me.
Her lips are getting weird and so his her language for she seems to hanging around with teens 24/7!!!!
LOL just read on the net comments, someone referred Lego Hair as Bible Spice.
ReplyDelete