Saturday, December 15, 2012

Rachel Maddow makes the case that it IS the appropriate time to talk about gun control. In fact it is well past the appropriate time. Update!


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Rachel makes some extremely good points in this segment, and also shares some startling facts that should make many Americans simply sick to their stomachs.

Of course it is time to talk about doing something about making guns far less accessible and keeping certain guns off of the streets altogether.

And it CAN be done.

Americans may bristle at the notion of doing anything as aggressive as what was done in Scotland, but how many parents out there would gladly trade away their right to own certain guns for the chance to feel that their children wee safe in their schools? Or in the malls? Or simply walking down the street?

And as for the NRA, well right now at least they seem unsure of their control of the gun control issue.

Salon pointed out yesterday that the official NRA Twitter account has gone silent, as so far today that remains true. Their last tweet was over 24 hours ago.
I imagine that they are as shocked as many of the rest of us, and simply do not know what they should say, or when they should say it. At any rate they are in no position to fight back against the idea of addressing gun control in this country.

P.S. I am going to go a little off topic in my own post to share a little breaking news about the shooter's mother and some assumptions that were made that were apparently false.

As many of you know much of the information that we all got originally turned out to be incorrect, including the shooter's name, the death of his father, and where his mother was killed.

And now we have this: 

A former school board official in Newtown called into question earlier reports that Nancy Lanza had been connected to Sandy Hook Elementary School, possibly as part of the teaching staff. 

“No one has heard of her,” said Lillian Bittman, who served on the local school board until 2011. “Teachers don’t know her.”

The belief that the mother was a kindergarten teacher is apparently partly explained here:

A law enforcement official speaking on condition of anonymity said investigators believe Lanza attended the school several years ago but appeared to have no recent connection to the place. 

At least one parent said Lanza’s mother was a substitute teacher there. But her name did not appear on a staff list. And the law enforcement official said investigators were unable to establish any connection so far between her and the school.

Yesterday may have been one of the most confusing information gathering days that I can remember since 9-11, and what once seemed to fit together no longer does.

But what we DO know is that these children were killed with hand guns that are simply TOO readily accessible in this country. And that is a problem that we CAN start to work on right now, before the next terrible incident has us again asking "when IS the right time to talk about gun control?"

Update: New information has emerged that might explain WHY Adam Lanza chose to target this school. This from Mediaite:

Attempting to answer the question of why Lanza may have chosen this particular school, Williams stated that it has been confirmed now that Lanza’s mother did not work full-time at the school, despite previous reports. 

However, officials told NBC that on Thursday, December 13, Lanza was involved in an “altercation” at the school which involved himself and four other staff members. Of the four, three were murdered in yesterday’s shooting spree and the fourth is currently being interviewed by federal and state investigators.

That is all we know thus far it appears.

65 comments:

  1. Anonymous6:57 AM

    I am in no way making light of what has happened, but I think this clip from Chris Rock is exactly what we need.

    Bullet Control
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZrFVtmRXrw

    ReplyDelete
  2. Olivia6:58 AM

    "I imagine that(the NRA) they are as shocked as many of the rest of us, and simply do not know what they should day, or when they should say it. At any rate they are in no position to fight back against the idea of addressing gun control in this country."

    Sorry, I think you are wrong. I think they are skulking down like the slimy cowards they are, maybe gathering reinforcements, hoping to avoid confrontation and waiting for their mindless minions to shoot down any criticism of their stance. I think they are in hiding while formulating more false statements about the cause of these mass murders they can spew forth. I think they are sending communications to all the politicians they have paid off warning them to not give in and probably promising more money for votes.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Anonymous7:30 AM

      One of the heads of one of the gun organizations -- not the NRA, one of the others -- already said that this wouldn't have happened if the teachers were armed...

      Delete
    2. And that moron knows that, how? I wonder...?

      I see a different scenario: The first people at the school that Lanza shot, the principal and another person -- supposing they'd been armed? But also, supposing there were half a dozen kids in the same space? Would an ensuing shootout involve dead kids in the crossfire, as well as mutual annihilation?

      Wouldn't -- SHOULDN'T -- an armed teacher be constrained by not wanting to hit innocent bystanders, something a determined armed intruder like Lanza wouldn't care about?

      Or does this RW arm-everybody mindset remove that constraint? Does it make the armed teacher not liable for "collateral damage" deaths? Or would there have to be enacted ANOTHER moronic "Stand Your Ground" type of law?

      Good God, how stupid can these "pro gun" people be? Even Krystal Ball was whining about "gun rights" yesterday morning on one of the MSNBC shows. She was afraid someone would want to confiscate her father's gun collection.

      Delete
    3. Anonymous1:44 PM

      As a retired school psychologist, I don't give a damn if I had immunity for "collateral" damage or not. Those are "my" kids and if I killed one, I wouldn't care what they did to me. (BTW, I'm a retired teacher &school psychologist; the other admin. killed yesterday was the school psych.)

      Elizabeth 44

      Delete
  3. Anonymous7:14 AM

    Heard the NRA deleted its facebook account yesterday also,too.
    I'm starting to hear "well, I want to be armed to go after 'them'" (crazy shooters) and I have to point out Gabby Giffords had a Glock and THAT didn't help her...
    There were some great comments yesterday with some good ideas. I hope everyone submits the ideas to congress or better yet our POTUS.

    ReplyDelete
  4. Anonymous7:48 AM

    Guns do not kill people. They just make it easier to kill people

    Margaret, can we – the American People – finally have a rational conversation about gun control?

    It was an elementary school this time – an elementary school with children the same age as my grandchildren. I can hardly bear it. Those poor precious children…

    Is the insanity of this enough for us to finally kick the NRA morons to the curb and have an intelligent conversation about the real reason for the Second Amendment?

    Yes. I know. Guns do not kill people. People using guns kill people. The same can be said about tanks.

    I have no doubt that in the coming days we will learn that no laws or gun control of any kind could have prevented this tragedy. There are millions of guns already out there and new gun control laws won’t do anything about that… bad people can always find a way to get a gun. Most gun owners are responsible people who have legitimate reasons to own a gun. So there’s nothing we can do, right?

    Bullshit. Not doing anything is not the answer. It’s the problem. I refuse to believe that hunters and responsible gun owners can’t have a meaningful conversation about better gun laws with citizens who do not wish to own guns.

    We are already hearing about the mental instability of the shooter – a child himself. And there will be meaningful conversation about the lack of good mental health policies and how that was the cause of all this and not gun control laws. Everyone can agree that mental illness, just like any illness, should not go untreated. So where is the disconnect? Why are conversations about mental illness and gun control mutually exclusive? Please Dear God if Republicans and Democrats can ever come together about something, this must be it. And for those of you who think now is not the time to talk about gun laws, I wholeheartedly agree. That conversation should have happened long ago. And it definitely should have happened before 20 precious children lost their lives.

    It doesn’t matter what type of gun was used. It doesn’t matter if that gun was obtained illegally or legally. It doesn’t matter if the person was mentally unstable or just plain evil. What matters is that the most powerful country on the globe must have an intelligent conversation about the manufacturing, sale and ownership of guns without someone screaming nonsense about the 2nd Amendment.

    Guns do not kill people. They make it easier to kill people. There are 314 million Americans and we own almost 300 million guns. That is the very definition of mental illness. I mean it. Really.

    http://margaretandhelen.com/2012/12/15/guns-do-not-kill-people-they-make-it-easier-to-kill-people/

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. eclecticsandra10:58 AM

      I think the 2nd amendment has been a diversion to keep the conversation on rights rather than effectiveness. Who is making money on this?

      Delete
    2. Anita Winecooler8:05 PM

      Thanks,

      "Guns do not kill people. They make it easier to kill people. There are 314 million Americans and we own almost 300 million guns. That is the very definition of mental illness. I mean it. Really."

      Well said, Helen!!

      I love Helen's fierceness , she's what I want to be when I reach "a certain age"!

      Delete
  5. Anonymous7:51 AM

    AP: Suspect used .223 caliber rifle. This is a picture of a .223 rifle. This is legal

    http://twitter.com/MarlowNYC/status/279655599585775616/photo/1

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    Replies
    1. Anonymous9:29 AM

      Heard he didn't use that at the school, it was found in the car. Glock and Sig handguns in school.

      Delete
    2. Anonymous1:49 PM

      The Coroner said this morning that all victims were killed by a rifle. I know that isn't what was in the news before, but that is the Coroner's report.

      Delete
  6. Anonymous7:56 AM

    Enjoy great performance and convenience from the Bushmaster .223 Remington SuperLight Carbine Semiautomatic Rifle that features a light-profile barrel. The rifle is designed with a telescoping stock and a red dot sight. Semiautomatic action with a 30-round magazine capacity.

    http://www.academy.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10151_10051_473701_-1

    This is one of the guns that the shooter had in his possession. Easily available on the net. Sick.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. "Enjoy great performance..."

      Enjoy.

      Words fail me. Yes, me.

      Delete
  7. Anonymous7:57 AM

    I think better mental health care is at least as important as gun control.

    And how about getting rid of violent video games that train youngsters to kill without remorse?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Chella9:08 AM

      There is a reason why video games have ratings. Usually, a video game with violence is rated so the buyer must be 17 years of age or older. I am 26, and I was IDed at game stop while buying my boyfriend Call of Duty Black Ops 2.

      If children are playing rated M games, it means their parents bought it for them.

      Don't blame the video games, that's ridiculous.

      Delete
    2. Anonymous10:12 AM

      Instead, ask why the video games that are the most violent are the most popular. It all meshes with the American mindset and the US wars that have been going on since around 1900.

      Delete
  8. Anonymous8:12 AM

    I was totally in support of Bob Costas when he spoke a few weeks ago and he got bulldozed for speaking out. I was disgusted -- so it was a flipping football game -- it was a football player that caused the murder. Since then, it has been reported that 7 players have turned in their guns. There should be many more who do the same as far too many believe themselves protected and above the law as we've seen far too many times where they get off charges with a slap on the wrist when others like you and I would be behind bars.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Anonymous9:30 AM

      No, lots of these guys are acknowledging that repeat concussions cause mental illness.

      Delete
  9. Anonymous8:17 AM

    Sandy Hook Shooting: World Reactions To Connecticut Tragedy

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/15/sandy-hook-shooting-world_n_2307073.html?utm_hp_ref=crime&ir=Crime

    ReplyDelete
  10. Anonymous8:19 AM

    Mass Shootings In U.S. Since 2005 (MAP)

    In the last 30 years, there have been 61 shootings across the country in which at least four people have been killed. Eleven of those incidents, according to Mother Jones, took place at schools.

    Friday's shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary is the second deadliest school shooting in the country's history, after only Virginia Tech, in which 32 people were killed by a gunman in 2007, according to the Associated Press.

    The Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence provided The Huffington Post with data on where mass shootings have occurred in the U.S. since 2005.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/14/mass-shootings-around-the-us-amp_n_2303432.html?utm_hp_ref=crime

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Anonymous11:22 AM

      But it's not the deadliest school killing ever. That happened back in 1927 in Bath, Michigan.

      Here's an article about it, including an interesting take on the aftermath.

      http://qz.com/37069/the-deadliest-school-massacre-in-us-history-was-in-1927-why-its-aftermath-matters-now/

      Rick

      Delete
  11. Paul - Minnesota8:20 AM

    Ugh. I know this is beyond your control Gryphen, yet when I viewed this post in the middle of it is an ad for 10 DAYS OF NRA GIVEAWAYS, DAY 4 is some emergency auto light. 2 winners.

    The NRA is disgusting.

    The 26 people (mostly kids) who died yesterday weren't winners due to the NRA.

    ReplyDelete
  12. Anonymous8:20 AM

    MSNBC has just reported that the shooter got into an altercation with 4 adults in the school days or the day before Friday. 3 of those adults are now dead. The 4th was not at the school on Friday and is being questioned as to the altercation, etc. Together with some info they found at the shooter's residence, there is a possibility there may be a finding of motive.

    I was disgusted with CNN's coverage yesterday as per their usual they were slamming to be FIRST TO REPORT and hours before fatalities were reported by the authorities, CNN was working 'their sources' and announced there were fatalities -- plural. Without listening to them for the majority of coverage, I can't confirm but it would not surprise me to hear they were the ones that put out the name of the brother and the location in NJ of another death.

    CNN is so concerned of being FIRST to up their shity ratings, they'll do and say anything they get without confirmation. They think they're so good but they once again should be held to answer how they continue to report BS. The hiring of Zucker -- means dick. Unless Ted Turner returns to take it back -- I hope the scum station continues to tank as they will report this 24/7 ad nauseam for a minimum of 2 weeks as they know their shows are bottom of the barrel crap and will OCD on this as per usual -- like they did on Michael Jackson's death -- the balloon boy -- just to name a few. They cause more people to have trauma than they help.

    ReplyDelete
  13. Paul - Minnesota8:24 AM

    Sorry, Gryphen. My mistake, as I now realize the 10 DAY of GIVEAWAYS was an example of what the NRA pushed before they yanked their tweets.

    The NRA is still disgusting.

    ReplyDelete
  14. Sharon8:37 AM

    It is like the perfect storm....easy access to handguns, military grade assult weapons, super violent video games, mental health denial, pressure upon pressure. How do teenagers survive anymore, losing your home, no jobs, never ending war, horrible fights in Washington...where does all that stress go? I am so thankful my girls are grown and out of college....but I had to speak to them yesterday. I still can't stop crying, just thinking about those 20 families waiting for their children to come out. We all know how much Obama adores little children, it was heartbreaking watching him try to speak. I for one hate guns, in any form...let true hunters use a bow and arrow, animals are killed far too easily just like humans.

    ReplyDelete
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    1. Anonymous9:34 AM

      Add in the cutting of gt classes and services. K-12 becomes a torture prison fro the truly gifted. example - my school district has cut, cut, cut gt classes - but the found the $$ to build a football field. What does that tell you about their priorities. This is in a Red State - DAMN MItch Daniels to whatever is hell for him - that continually cuts academic funding..

      Delete
    2. Anonymous9:36 AM

      Meanwhile, parents in my Red State who have kids with mental disorders have to allow themselves to be charged with criminal negligence or abandonment to get help for their kids.

      Delete
  15. Anonymous8:38 AM

    I still swear, and I mean swear at my family about the 2nd amendment. They are not allowed in my house if they're carrying. In fact -- some family have been banned from my house. Friends -- I've broken relationships with. My house - My rules. Don't like them -- there's the door. Never spoken to those family members or friends since.

    2nd Amendment -- It was written when they had muskets; when they owned slaves. At no time were any of them able to think ahead to know what would guns, etc. would be in the future.

    Fuck the 2nd amendment. It's been glorified and raised up to be god of the land. I fucking hate the 2nd amendment. Always have -- always will. People including the various Presidents IMO have never given serious thought and voice to fact of when it was written nor how those writing same would have foreseen the future of what is the guns available. It's become the $$$$ issue of the manufacturers, the NRA & the bagger bible thumpers of the land -- screw the lives of people. Just like after a baby is born. They care more about conceiving and protecting than when they're born. The US of Assholes.

    ReplyDelete
  16. Anonymous8:39 AM

    Well, this must be the 'conversation', for what it's worth. A few words anyway on the off chance they won't be deleted.
    The US is a violent nation which has no qualms about going to war for economic and political gain. Undoubtedly the nation that far outstrips any other in aggression. And the callous greed and nature of capitalism doesn't hold it back. Each and every one of you are completely sold on supporting your wars (you call it supporting the troops) and so none of you will take the time to think about the ruthless disregard for human life you are fostering.
    When a nation becomes such, as did Nazi Germany or Italy, it becomes natural that the reckless disregard for human life carries over to the nation's own people. When people in other countries (your victim countries) are regarded as vermin or less than human, it's ensured that your citizens will adopt the same attitude toward it's own.

    And so, with your lack of laws restricting guns you have ensured that the tools are all readily available to anyone who bears the slightest grudge against his neighbour.

    When you become a peaceful nation again then your domestic violence will decline in pace. It won't happen until you do. So there's the beginning of the 'conversation'. I can do no more than introduce you to it and to the truth.

    I have huge doubts that any of you will now want to deal with the truth. But even if a few do, it will be small and meaningless and nothing will change until your country makes the change.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Anonymous12:24 PM

      I can't think of any bigger moron than the one who thinks every single person in a country believes the exact same thing. Congratulations.

      Delete
  17. Anonymous8:45 AM

    U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton fainted and suffered a concussion, the Associated Press reported on Saturday. Clinton is now "recovering at home."

    More details from CBS News' Margaret Brennan:

    margaret brennan✔
    @margbrennan

    #SecClinton dehydrated from stomach bug, fainted & sustained a concussion per StateDept's Philippe Reines. Recovering @ home

    http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/report-hillary-clinton-faints-suffers-concussion

    ReplyDelete
  18. Anonymous8:50 AM

    A law enforcement source told CBS News that Adam Lanza had three weapons with him during the attack: Two handguns (a Sig Sauer and a Glock), and a Bushmaster .223 assault rifle; spent shells were found in the school. Those three weapons were registered to his mother.

    There was also a fourth weapon (a long gun) found in the car he drove to the school.

    In addition, the source told CBS News there were "a few" other weapons found at the mother's house. The registry of the weapon in the car and at the house are still be checked. The tracing of all the weapons - such as where and when they were purchased - is still being conducted.

    The Associated Press reports a Henry repeating rifle, an Enfield rifle and a shotgun were recovered. It was not clear exactly where those weapons were found.

    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57559395/conn-school-shooter-had-4-weapons/

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Anonymous11:19 AM

      WTF was she doing with all the guns? And with a mentally questionable son at that? I have guns in my house, inherited from my dad and my husband's service revolver but I live in the middle of rural IN and am alone some times when my husband is away. She lived in a nice suburb in major dollar homes and was armed to the teeth. That's some crazy shit right there.

      Delete
    2. So many guns/rifles registered to the mother! WHY would she need all these weapons??

      Delete
    3. Anonymous3:10 PM

      It may have been her belief system. I don't know for certain but she may have had a survivalist philosophy. I think she was teaching her son or sons how to protect their hoard when the end times came.

      Delete
  19. Anonymous9:01 AM

    One of the guests on Alex Witt's weekend show -- his first name Jimmy, who is a frequent guest on MSNBC just made a great suggestion.

    With all the cops and equipment in DC to make the house, congress, etc. the safest place in the nation after the two cops had been shot some years back -- parents should take their children to DC to speak out saying that their kids are safe there but not safe in their schools. SHAME them to do something.

    ReplyDelete
  20. Anonymous9:12 AM

    Obviously, FOX News will be blaming Susan Rice for not knowing all of the details from the beginning. After all, how many Americans were killed? How could Susan Rice not know whether the shooter's victim was a teacher at the school at the current time or had been in the past. Why was there a coverup? Why did the police give news conferences on all of the various stations without having the full facts at hand? Fox News knows that this is the reason Susan Rice is unfit to be Secretary of State.

    ReplyDelete
  21. Anonymous9:24 AM

    The very large number of guns in the hands of Americans, along with the type of guns, is indicative of the problem. So in truth it's not the guns that kill people, it's the people who are obsessed and fascinated with guns and the people who are brainwashed and indoctrinated into supporting killing that are the problem. The American people are the problem. Other countries can own as many guns but it will always be the countries that are warmongering continuously where the gun violence will exceed the 'normal' background level in other countries. Watch the U.K., watch even Canada, watch Poland, or watch any nation that is supportive of your wars. You'll see that the way they regard human life outside their own countries will soon carry over to how they regard their own citizens.

    Consider the way Zimmermann had no regard for the life of his victim. Consider how he even weant hunting for his victim with a bloodlust to kill. Then you will come to the realization that the gun is not the main problem. It's the need for those guns that are the problem and it just so happens that the tools are readily avialable in abundance.

    Are you ready for the 'conversation' yet?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Anonymous3:12 PM

      The very large number of guns in the hands of Americans, along with the type of guns, is indicative of the problem.


      Many fear based people in the population.

      Delete
  22. Anonymous9:57 AM

    Dec 13th Tweet from NRA:

    NRA ‏@NRA
    #Florida nears 1 million permits for concealed weapons

    Disgusting to know in your mind they are cheering this.

    We had planned on a family vacation at Disney in FL and were going to surprise the kids on Christmas. We've cancelled our plans. Have no desire to step foot in FL again. Ever.

    When you add the BS that the Gov has pushed through like where pediatritions cannot even ask parents if they have guns in their house and that they are secure -- someone needs to take him 'out'.

    ReplyDelete
  23. Anonymous9:57 AM

    Consider too that the killer's mother owned those guns and also consider the types of guns. His mother???? What's wrong with this picture. Has the mother's ugly gungoon mentality carried over to the son in any way? Was it not natural at least in part for the son to turn to weapons and violence? Are my comments about the American mindset of violence and killing starting to make any sense to any of you yet?

    Do any Americans understand this?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Anonymous10:36 AM

      Sounds like she's a Fox watcher and might even be a Beck follower as she was stockpiling according to a relative or a friend.

      Delete
    2. Anonymous12:11 PM

      which is such a great idea when you're the fulltime caregiver of a 20 something who by latest accounts is not only autistic but very disturbed.

      Delete
    3. Anonymous12:20 PM

      No, not a single one of us can fathom your genius comments. So sorry. Maybe try again in a year or so. Or just fuck off maybe?

      Delete
    4. Anonymous1:58 PM

      Nothing is certain at this point but someone was saying the mother taught Adam how to shoot the guns. She was a survivalist. I think David Chaney's family was also into that thinking. It is popular in some circles, the stockpiling and all.

      It is big business. They prey on those who see the end of the world as eminent.

      Delete
    5. Anonymous2:27 PM

      Was he home schooled?

      Adam Lanza belonged to a technology club at Newtown High School that held "LAN parties" – short for local area network – in which students would gather at a member's home, hook up their computers into a small network and play games.
      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/15/adam-lanza-newtown-school-shooter-honors-student_n_2306736.html

      Delete
  24. Anonymous10:19 AM

    NBC: Suspected Shooter Had ‘Altercation’ With School Staff

    Adam Lanza, the suspected shooter of a Newtown, Conn. elementary school Friday, reportedly had an "altercation" with four school staff members the day before the attack, law officials tell NBC News:


    Three of the four staff members were killed Friday in one of the worst school shootings in U.S. history. The fourth staff member was not at school that day and is being interviewed by federal and state investigators, NBC News’ Pete Williams said.

    Two days before that, Adam Lanza, 20, went to a sporting goods store in Danbury, Conn., and tried to purchase a rifle, but was rebuffed because the state has a waiting period for gun sales, the officials said.

    http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/nbc-suspected-shooter-had-altercation-with-school-staff

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Anonymous10:38 AM

      Read about the altercatin at 8:20 above.

      Delete
  25. Anonymous10:21 AM

    Top House Dem: To Do Nothing On Guns Is To Be ‘Complicit’ In Attacks

    Rep. John Larson (D-CT), who chairs the House Democratic caucus, released a strongly worded statement on Saturday arguing that no action on gun control in the wake of a mass shooting spree in Newtown, Conn. was to be "complicit" in the attacks, the Hartford Courant reports:

    “Friday was a day of mourning, but the time to act is now upon us,” Larson said in a strongly worded statement issued Saturday afternoon.

    “To do nothing in the face of continuous assaults on our children is to be complicit in those assaults. There may not be a single cure-all for the violence in our nation, however we must start the process and begin the deeper and longer conversations that need to take place.

    “Politics be damned. Of the 12 deadliest shootings in our nation’s history, half of them have happened in the last five years. And there is not a single person in America who doesn’t fear it will happen again. It’s time we recognize the danger and address it,” Larson said.

    http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/top-house-dem-to-do-nothing-on-guns

    ReplyDelete
  26. Anonymous10:32 AM

    Would people have so many guns if they had to maintain insurance on each one? What if they had to show "paid-up premiums" or certificates of ownership everytime they puchased ammunition?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Anonymous10:58 AM

      Just think of the liability insurance premiums the insurance companies would stack on and as you said, you have to show proof. Show proof of insurance at time of purchase -- some shops would close -- others would survive as some would starve their kids before they gave up their guns.

      Delete
    2. Anonymous11:10 AM

      The absolute minimum would be the same things required to get a driver's license or own a car.

      Delete
    3. Anonymous2:00 PM

      I think the liability insurance is a brilliant idea!

      Delete
    4. Anonymous2:26 PM

      Rich people will have stockpiles. The poor will have to steal.

      Delete
  27. Anonymous10:36 AM

    Pakistani children light candles to pay tribute to Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting victims in southern Pakistani port city of Karachi on Dec. 15, 2012. Pakistan has sent condolences to the United States over the shooting incident, local media reported Saturday.

    http://media.talkingpointsmemo.com/slideshow/connecticut-newtown-school-shooting/1-287703

    ReplyDelete
  28. Anonymous10:40 AM

    A man opened fire early Saturday at a hospital in Alabama, wounding a police officer and two employees before being shot and killed by another officer, authorities said.

    Police were sent to St. Vincent's Hospital around 4 a.m. to check on a report of an armed man inside the facility. Two officers who arrived separately converged on the suspect on the hospital's fifth floor.

    "When the officer encountered the suspect, there was immediate gunfire from the suspect," Birmingham Police Sgt. Johnny Williams said. One police officer and two hospital employees who happened to be in the area were wounded.

    A second officer shot back, mortally wounding the suspect.

    Williams said detectives were still trying to determine Saturday why the armed man was in the hospital.

    Authorities did not immediately release the names of the assailant or the victims.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/15/alabama-hospital-shooting-wounded-gunman-killed_n_2307505.html

    ReplyDelete
  29. Anonymous10:46 AM

    Gun Sales In 2012 Set Record, FBI Data Indicates

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/14/gun-sales-2012_n_2303513.html?ref=topbar

    ReplyDelete
  30. Anonymous11:18 AM

    The U.S. military kills children every single day. Collateral damage it is called. Obama told reporters he selects 'targets' everyday via U.S. drones. Unfortunately, children get 'in the way'.

    Listen, there is an agenda to take guns away from the American people - an agenda most American have NEVER heard of - or better yet - don't WANT to hear of. Take the time to learn of 'MKUltra' and 'Agenda 21'. Forget the 'conspiracy nut' crap. This stuff is real and it's about time to start informing yourself or you will be lead to the slaughter.

    Unfortunately these powers-that-be have resorted to the lowest of the low - elementary school children. These people are psychopaths - they will do anything to get their message across - loud and clear. It's going to get worse. As for me, I'm keeping my guns. They have saved my life before and they may do the same in the future.

    ReplyDelete
  31. Anonymous11:47 AM

    You know, today I was home alone (hubby out all day) and I was baking. I like to bake when it's cold because the oven helps warm the house. Anyway, I was also listening to Van Morrison (personal favorite) and thinking about those children gunned down, murdered, in their classrooms and crying softly when a song came on by Morrison, "Memories" It made me cry even more..

    All I have is memories
    All I have is memories
    Memories of you

    Now you're gone
    They linger on, these memories
    All these precious memories
    Memories of you

    How they linger in the twilight
    In the morning in the small hours
    Just before dawn

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  32. Anonymous12:32 PM

    I would like to respond to the graphic re: guns in Scotland. (Source: http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/scotland)

    1. The estimated total number of guns held by civilians in Scotland is 280,000.

    2. The rate of private gun ownership in Scotland is 5.5 firearms per 100 people.

    3. The number of registered guns in Scotland is reported to be 212,607.

    4. In Scotland, the number of rifles in civilian possession is reported to be 45,254.

    5. There are reportedly 566 handguns in civilian possession in Scotland.

    In the UK:

    In 2008 The Independent reported that there were 42 gun-related deaths in Great Britain, a 20-year low.[63] However, in late 2009 The Telegraph reported that gun crime had doubled in the last 10 years, with an increase in both firearms offences and deaths. A government spokesman said this increase was a result of a change in reporting practices in 2001 and that gun crime had actually fallen since 2005. Chris Grayling, the Shadow Home Secretary (an opposition party spokesperson), attributed the rise to ineffective policing and an out-of-control gang culture.[64] Writing in the British Journal of Criminology, Dr Jeanine Baker and Dr Samara McPhedran found no measurable effect detectable from the 1997 firearms legislation with ARIMA statistical analysis.[13]
    In the year Apr 2010 to Mar 2011 there were 11,227 recorded offences involving firearms, broken down as follows.
    By weapon type:
    Long-barrelled shotgun = 406
    Sawn-off shotgun = 202
    Handgun = 3,105
    Rifle = 74
    Imitation firearm = 1,610
    Unidentified firearm = 957
    Other firearm = 670
    Air weapons = 4,203
    (Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_the_United_Kingdom)

    I only want to point out a flaw in the graphic in that there are guns in Scotland and the UK.

    I too am horrified about the recurrent tragedies, all of which have strained our collective sensibilities and emotions over the senseless taking of lives, which seem to be happening on a daily basis.

    Vero Guy

    ReplyDelete
  33. Anonymous12:43 PM

    Names Of Elementary School Shooting Victims Released

    State police released the names of the victims of an elementary school shooting spree in Newtown, Conn. on Saturday, the Associated Press reports:


    All six adults killed at the school were women. Of the 20 children who were shot to death, eight were boys and 12 were girls. All the children were ages 6 or 7.

    Investigators are trying to learn more about 20-year-old gunman Adam Lanza, who killed himself after the massacre.

    The complete list, via ABC News:


    Charlotte Bacon, 6

    Daniel Barden, 7

    Rachel Davino, 29

    Olivia Engel, 6

    Josephine Gay, 7

    Ana Marquez-Greene, 6

    Dylan Hockley, 6

    Dawn Hocksprung, 47

    Madeline Hsu, 6

    Catherine Hubbard, 6

    Chase Kowalski, 7

    Jesse Lewis, 6

    James Mattioli, 6

    Grace McDonnell, 7

    Anne Marie Murphy, 52

    Emilie Parker, 6

    Jack Pinto, 6

    Noah Pozner, 6

    Caroline Previdi, 6

    Jessica Rekos, 6

    Avielle Richman, 6

    Lauren Russeau, 30

    Mary Sherlach, 56

    Victoria Soto, 27

    Benjamin Wheeler, 6

    Allison Wyatt, 6

    http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/names-of-elementary-school-shooting-released

    ReplyDelete
  34. Anonymous2:35 PM

    I turned off the news on this today after listening to the medical doctor (who seemed to have a weird personality!) give his opinions, knowledge and thoughts and then to hear one of the newscasters afterwards STILL skew what the medical doctor had just said to enhance viewership to him and his channel.

    There have been so many things proven WRONG that the news channels have been saying for the past days - their commentators have talked and talked, repeating the same thing minute by minute and hour by hour and so much of what they said was WRONG!

    The media needs to keep their mouths shut about these tragic events UNTIL they learn the facts!
    They compound the errors by spreading fear - hate -magnifying events to the story - not being factual - and then not even admitting they were WRONG when the truth begins to come out. No wonder they are doing a lock down on what is being said from Newtown. I'd pour concrete to block the media from having access to the town. They are nothing more than vampires!

    Friggin' amazing!!! They make me sick to my stomach! And, I fear for the families of the children that were killed - I cannot even begin to imagine what the press/media will do to them in the coming days. If I were one of those families - I'd get my gun out and threaten them at the borders of my property.

    Did you listen to the questions they were asking of the children to get it and them on the news? Did you listen to their assine questions? What a horrible profession to be a part! Each has sold their soul!

    All for the story - be it true or not and whether trying to gain the story is ethical or not! This is not the freedom of the press I want to see in the USA every fucking day!

    Turn off your TV folks and take a walk outside and smell the air!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Anonymous6:39 PM

      We only watch Daily Show and Colbert, no cable news. Other than that it's only SouthPark and Movies and other ridiculous pursuits on our TV. Cable news is just crazy and not for the faint of heart. They play these tragedies up like crazy, just like 911 and really just create reality of their own even when they don't have all of the info.

      Delete
  35. Anonymous7:25 AM

    It maybe written here already so if so, apologise in advance, but in Australia we had a national ban on assault rifles after a mass shooting in Port Arthur, Tasmania in 1996. We have never really had a gun culture, but after the ban there has not been a mass shooting. To support the ban, thy had a gun amnesty and every income earner paid a special levy to contribute to the buy back scheme where sellers were given market price and the guns were destroyed. It was pretty much 99% approved of by both our houses and the people as a whole.

    ReplyDelete

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