As part of its extensive study on Americans' views of abortion that was released Monday, Pew Research Center broke down the findings to provide a closer look at a number of groups and sub-groups, including by region and gender.
You know what I find fascinating? That the Evangelicals, who seem to take most of their cues from the Old Testament rather than the New, are overwhelmingly anti-abortion, while the Jewish community, whose Torah essentially IS the Old Testament, are overwhelmingly pro-choice.
It would seem that SOMEBODY is suffering from difficulties with reading comprehension.
That reminds me by the way of this brilliant bit by Lewis Black pertaining to Christians misunderstanding or the Old Testament.
Also, I am surprised by the White Catholic segment. I would have thought, they were the most against abortion.
ReplyDeletehahahahahahahahahahaha 98% of RCC women use or have used bc at one time. And most of them want to know they can have an abortion if the Bc fails. Catholics are practical. Hence teh "workingman's and woman's informal dispensation of hot dogs on Fridays.)
DeleteMost women sorta listen to the RCC - it's the social aspect fro cradle catholics - what Soren Kierkegaard raged against in Denmark in the 19th century - where beignborn danish also meant one was born Chritian. As Kierkegaard recognized that makes religion like the wallpaper of your life - and one pays it about as much attention (compared to a work of art that one chooses.)
5:30, may I assume that the 98% you mention is American catholics since this was a poll of US adults? I'm pretty sure Italian and French catholics would show different results.
DeleteJust because the church is against it, doesn't mean educated church members follow it. Just like birth control, I have only known ONE white catholic woman that used the rhythm method and got on the pill after her third child and then got a tubal.
DeleteI think overall American catholics are some of the LEAST controlled church members in the USA and the most educated. Yes I do think education leads to free thinking, imagine that. BTW I don't know of one catholic piest( and I know a few because I have studied with them {I have a theology degree and no I am not religious at all, just interested in religions}) that cares about birth control or abortion and are for family planning because the first and foremost reason for marital splits are financial and too many children that you can't afford lead to divorce.
BTW this poll is for a matter in the USA why would anyone poll Italians?
@ 8:51.
DeleteI brought up the Italians because the statement made by 5:30 made a statement about a huge percentage of RCC women and did NOT identify it as specifically a US number. She merely said 98% of RCC women.
I just like to keep facts straight and accurate. Also, if you read my statement again, you will note that I ASKED the person replying if they meant this to be strictly a US number and mentioned the Italians (and the French) because the 98% figure would NOT be true for them. Merely a discussion factor.
What always astounds me is that these people are against any and all abprtion, but have NO problem supporting the death penalty, Gitmo, torture, and every war the GOP can think up. Not to mention they hate social programs, public schools, and spending money for infrastructure. It's as if all these miracles in the womb suddenly become worthless uless they are white and orn into wealthy families. Since in all the years this book has been translated, not ONE man thought to add language against abortion or gays, I don't think God gives a crap.
ReplyDeleteTHANK YOU, Sally!
DeleteHowever, there ARE passages in the bible against gay sexuality. The first to come to mind are Leviticus 20:13 and Lev. 18:22.
Of course, it is ALL crap in my book, so I don't accept their hatred any more than any sane person should since the people who actually believe this stuff CANNOT understand that the bible didn't have a single clue about hormones and organic chemistry or real internal medicine. Hardliners are the WORST scum as far as I am concerned. (The only thing I can think of at this time that is worse to me is someone who abuses children! Do you hear that mister pope?)
Kill a baby and save a killer
DeleteThat is how pro lifers view The PRO CHOICERS
Clearly, from this graph, the majority of Americans believe abortion should be legal.
ReplyDeleteThis doesn't mean they think it's the best solution to the problem of unwanted pregnancies -- sex education and easy access to birth control are obviously far superior options. So is the morning-after pill.
I wholeheartedly believe in pro-choice, although I don't know if I could ever bring myself to have an abortion, unless I'd been raped, been attacked by a relative, or my health was in danger.
Nonetheless, I cannot withhold this choice from others. I can and do promote education of women, so they are fully informed when they are faced with the choice. But it's not MY life or MY child who will be affected by a mother's decision, and it's not my place to put restrictions on her decision. Only she can know what is right for her. She and her doctor.
I wouldn't have the affrontary -or legal right -- to enter an examination room where a doctor and his or her patient are discussing her options. It's a medical and personal decision in which I have no place.
Hear! Hear!
Deleteand + infinity, also, too
thatcrowwoman
This graph doesn't really portray that the majority of Americans approve of abortion. It merely shows the percentages in GROUPS and how those groups feel about the subject.
DeleteOn the other hand, further reading in the memo writings concerning the subject clearly shows that 54% of Americans approve of legal abortions. (Click on the blue TALKING POINTS MEMO above, then click on Gender highlighted in red.)
My point? I was just picking to be a wee more accurate.
Otherwise, aside from that one point, I completely agree with you and laud your attitude. It is clearly open, honest and revealing. Good for you!
I just wish more people felt that way, since the reverse of the 54% says that 46% feel they DO have the right to tell other people what they can and can't do!
NOT good! With the tolerances polls have, that means pretty much it is neck and neck.
My mom is a pro life loon. Seriously.
DeleteI once asked her why she doesn't spend all that time and money on helping PREVENT pregnancies and HELPING THE girls who. Chose Life !
No answer. She is like a child and can only comprehend what she Sees as " right" and "wrong".
She wouldn't help teach sex education because SHE ( and the church) don't think children and TEENS need to know that.
She still wouldn't feel comfortable helping unwed teen moms because she would be too busy judging them " in her heart".
seriously.
She really doesn't get it but she really is crazy. Seriously.
Whenever I am questioned by an anti-abortion person, I always interject with this question: "Excuse me, but are you in favor of universal health care?" The answer to that question is important because, if a person wants to deny others access to abortion and to good heath care, then that person has no moral standing in my opinion.
ReplyDeleteWith regard to the graph, it would also be interesting to see how education levels affect these opinions. I'm willing to bet that the more education people have, the more they are willing to let others have the right of choice in these matters.
Beaglemom
Probably true for most liberal/conservative decisions, I would think, Beaglemom.
DeleteJesse, our Torah is what Christians know as the first 5 books of their Old Testament.
ReplyDeleteThe Jewish Bible includes much of "their Old Testament" but not in the same order.
Judaism isn't frozen in the Bronze Age; not so sure about the Christianist fundamentalists.
Jews have studied and discussed and argued for all our generations about what it means to be a Jew and how to live our lives. See our rich folk heritage and folktales from from all over the world. See the Talmud, "the body of Jewish civil and ceremonial law and legend comprising the Mishnah (text) and the Gemara (commentary)."
Heck, see me talking to myself often enough.
I don't speak for all Jews anymore than you speak for all atheists, Jesse, but I am of the house of Rabbi Hillel who taught,
"That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow. This is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary. Go and learn."
See my tribe's take on the Golden Rule there?
All that being said, the graph sure tells a story, eh?
If they'd flip it, the political leanings would line up left to right, also, too.
This Jewess knows that "Messianic Jews" are really "Jews for Jesus"
and that the Evangelicals don't really love teh Jews, they just need us for their Rapture.
What they all really need is a heaping helping of Hillel's Go & Learn, and my mama's Mind Your Own Business, just saying.
(Mama was a public health nurse in the 60s and 70s, Our Bodies Our Selves. Same struggles, different millennium.)
L'Shalom,
thatcrowwoman
Thank you for reminding everyone (or maybe it's the first time they've ever heard), that the correct name for "Mesianic Jews" or "Jews of Jesus" is..."Christian."
Delete6:54, i wouldn't say that too loudly in earshot of Messianic Jews. The argument that will ensue will be reminiscent of that between catholic and protestant.
DeleteSOME will agree with you while others will definitely NOT. Too many subtle differences in beliefs.
I have a cousin who joined a Mesianic group (we are Jewish). I went to her wedding. In order to be saved you must accept Jesus Christ as you personal savior. Jesus is the world's salvation. There isnt anything subtle about that. To me and to other Jews, that makes you a Christian.
DeleteBelieve me, I wouldn't star that conversation with any "Jew for Jesus." I consider myself ethnically Jewish, but completely areligious.
O/T but you have to see this Gryphen:
ReplyDeleteJohn McCain To The New Republic: ‘I Think That Fox News Is A Bit Schizophrenic’
http://www.mediaite.com/online/john-mccain-to-the-new-republic-%E2%80%98i-think-that-fox-news-is-a-bit-schizophrenic%E2%80%99/
John McCain, Undecided 2016 Voter An exclusive interview on Fox News, Tea Party nihilism, and Hillary Clinton vs. Rand Paul in 2016
http://www.newrepublic.com/article/114082/john-mccain-interview#
Fucking McCain is playing the ol' victim violin for Baldy. Calling her decent is disgusting. And to promote this 'liberal media' crap just feeds into her victimhood. She earned every one of her media 'hits'.
ReplyDeleteIC: Does it bother you when people say choosing Sarah Palin is your legacy?
JM: No, because I think historians will decide that facts are stubborn things. We were four points down when I chose her and three points up afterwards. She held her own and, some people said, won a debate with the vice president. She did everything I ever wanted. She excited our base in a way I was unable to achieve. And then I watched the shredding and destruction to destroy a good and decent person by the liberal media, beginning with Katie Couric. Not only do I not regret it, but I have probably not seen anyone in American life savaged like she was, particularly by the liberal left.
IC: Do you draw any connection between her outlook and the group of congressional Republicans, Tea Partiers, that you have had trouble with?
JM: No, because I think she had a positive message. A message that we would have less government, lower taxes, less regulation. Many in this group didn’t come to power to get things done. They came to power to keep things from getting done.
IC: But she also accused Obama of “palling around with terrorists.” It wasn’t entirely positive.
JM: Well, if she attacked Obama and Biden, that is fairly standard.
IC: “Palling around with terrorists”?
JM: With all due respect, you never heard about when John Lewis said my campaign was worse than the Birmingham church bombing? That may have escaped your attention.
IC: It did. I agree, that is bad.
JM: OK, well, that is what he did, when they orchestrated this “racism” effort against me. Maybe Sarah Palin said “palling around with terrorists,” but the things that were said about me and her were far worse. I’ll never forgive John Lewis.
IC: Did you ever talk to Lewis?
JM: No. I would be glad to show you the press release. But we selectively take something Palin said, and the vice president’s job is to attack, and how many people know about John Lewis? I can show you many other comments. For me to complain about it is a waste of time.
http://www.newrepublic.com/article/114082/john-mccain-interview#
Gryphen, have you seen this?
ReplyDeleteIf this is the kind of person he chooses for his COMMUNICATIONS Director, he is more clueless than I thought. What kind of person is this that works for Weiner? And a WOMAN calling another woman names like this is so vile and disgusting it makes me sick to my stomach.
Weiner Comm Director Goes On Epic Tirade Against Former Intern: ‘F*cking Slutbag,’ ‘F*ck You, You Little C*nt’
http://www.mediaite.com/online/weiner-comm-director-goes-on-epic-tirade-against-former-intern-fcking-slutbag-fck-you-you-little-cnt/
Did you read that woman's report that Weiner called every female "Monica"... repeatedly?
DeleteShe didn't seem to think he was joking.
Quite frankly, it doesn't really matter.
The group calling itself Groundswell has been meeting since early in 2013 and is formulating propaganda, organizing consistent messaging, and devising plans for what they are calling “a 30 front war seeking to fundamentally transform the nation.” The ultra-conservatives include wife of Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas, conservative journalists, a former ALEC executive, John Bolton, Frank Gaffney, the Family Research Council, Allen West, the Catholic Family and Human Rights Institute, a top aide to Ted Cruz, and a collection of far-right extremists convinced that congressional Republicans are not taking the neo-con’s battle for America to President Obama and progressives with enough rage. According to documents obtained by Mother Jones, other influential groups asking to be included are conservative belief-tanks Heritage, FreedomWorks, Americans for Prosperity, and the NRA to assist in spreading one simple message; “Our country is in peril.”
ReplyDeleteGroundswell is deliberately targeting LIVs (low information voters) and collaborating with extremist Senators Jeff Sessions and Ted Cruz as well as a teabagger representative Jim Bridenstine to bolster the right’s message and plot strategy. Their goal is driving their extremist narrative on issues such as voter ID, immigration reform, the sequester, and to promote what they term “politically useful scandals such as the Benghazi attack, IRS targeting teabagger groups,” and of course the phony Affordable Care Act “horror stories.” Their success cannot be underestimated as Republicans in Congress have made great use of their propaganda to obstruct meaningful legislation to grow the economy, pass immigration reform, or correct indiscriminate cuts in the sequester.
http://www.politicususa.com/2013/07/31/groundswell-republican-distortion-misinformation-puts-nation-peril.html
The Republican Party is now paralyzed
ReplyDeleteRefusing to even consider the president's proposal yesterday shows they can't even help their own constituents now
There was a time, about two summers ago, when Republicans in Congress opposed the president for a reason. The reason wasn’t exactly an honorable or stirring one, but at least it had a logic to it. The thinking, reportedly articulated by Paul Ryan among others, went a little something like this: Any grand bargain, no matter how tilted to the right wing, would only help Obama win reelection. But all-out intransigence, when paired with a weak economy and looming debt, would make Obama look ineffectual, weak, and in over his head. And that was the way back to 1600 Penn.
But then Mitt Romney happened, and we all know how that went.
Cut to yesterday, more than two years later, and depressingly little has changed. There Obama stands; still president, still trying, and still finding no serious partner with whom to bargain. But whereas the original grand bargain was truly sweeping in its ambitions, trading (too few) tax hikes for (too many) cuts to social insurance programs like Medicare and Social Security, this latest iteration of what some have called the president’s white whale is far more modest. And yet Republican resistance is, if anything, even firmer.
This time around, Obama is essentially asking to trade a cut to corporate tax rates in exchange for greater investment in jobs programs and public infrastructure. It’s a perfectly sensible deal, too, one in which each side gets something they’ve long wanted, and each side gives the other something they’d, in a perfect world, probably rather not. Needless to say, Republicans hate it.
http://www.salon.com/2013/07/31/the_republican_party_is_now_paralyzed/
We Don't Want To Be The Party Of Bigots, But...
ReplyDeleteApparently the Young Republican National Federation is kind of bummed that the party is being run by racist, misogynist, bigoted homophobes and such, and they really wish party leaders and Republicans in Congress would be, you know, less embarrassing, according to newly elected federation chairman, Jason Weingartner.
Weingartner said House Republicans, who won’t pass the Democratic-led Senate’s version of an immigration overhaul, should pass their own version that at least “streamlines and expands” legal slots for foreign students and workers.
For now, he said, that would sidestep Republicans who demand border security and Democrats who demand a citizenship path for immigrants already in the country illegally.
On health care, Weingartner said that besides regularly voting to repeal Obama’s law, the GOP should emphasize its own ideas such as buying insurance across state lines, while better explaining the Affordable Care Act’s cost shift onto younger, healthy individuals.
On same-sex marriage and abortion, young GOP leaders say Republicans should tolerate a range of views, even while maintaining a socially conservative identity. Some of these activists say their party must tread lightly after the Supreme Court recently threw out the most powerful part of the Voting Rights Act, the law that became a major turning point in black Americans’ struggle for equal rights and political power.
“We don’t have to lose our principles,” said Angel Garcia, who leads the Young Republicans in Chicago, Obama’s hometown. “But we have to have a conversation on all these issues so we don’t leave Democrats to say we’re just old white men and racist, bigoted homophobes.”
I got news for you, YRNF. Your party already abandoned its principles, and only cares now about causing as much damage to the American people as possible in order to convince them it's Obama's fault. They don't have new ideas or any alternatives to fix the problems we face because they don't want those problems fixed. They don't have any intention of tolerating anyone they don't agree with. I'm glad you recognize the fact, but the grim reality is there's no "saving" this Republican party, because they oppose government itself.
That conversation you long for has already happened in the minds of tens of millions of Americans, and you guys lost. And you're going to have to do a hell of a lot more than just mope about a conference to get anyone to listen to what you have to say, Democrat or Republican.
http://zandarvts.blogspot.com/2013/07/we-dont-want-to-be-party-of-bigots-but.html
A 'Legendary' Outbreak Of Mosquitoes Has Taken Over The Alaskan Arctic Tundra
ReplyDeleteColumbia graduate student Shannan Sweet posted this YouTube video of the insane swarms of mosquitoes that have overwhelmed researchers on the Arctic Tundra.
Sweet herself has been studying the plants of the tundra in Alaska for the last three years, and is careful to tell us that she doesn't study mosquitoes. But, she says, "people who have been in that area for longer than me said it was the worst they had seen it."
University of Alaska entomologist Derek Sikes told the Alaska Dispatch that no one is monitoring the mosquito population in the state, so no one has specific numbers for how bad this outbreak is.
The Alaska Dispatch agrees that it's quite nasty, though:
Alaska's blood-hungry mosquito hordes are nastier than they've been in years, and they show no signs of letting up. In fact, the swarming predators seem to be growing in number...
In her email to Business Insider, Sweet suggested some reasons why this is a particularly bad summer:
http://www.businessinsider.com/mosquitoes-taking-over-the-arctic-tundra-2013-7