Courtesy of HuffPo:
In a vote last week, members of the political group -- which supports secular government and the reinforcement of the separation of church and state -- selected the "Secular Party of America" as their new name. The change had reportedly been in the works for months, and over 75 percent of the party's members voted in support of the rebrand.
Vice President of Public Relations and Marketing Bernard “Flash” Kellish“ hailed the move in a statement.
"We are certain that not only is the new name far more inclusive of a greater number of Americans that share our vision of true separation of church and state, but that it will open the door to those that may not have joined us if for no other reason than because 'Atheist' was in the name," he said. "We were created by atheists as a way to be a hereunto unrepresented voice in politics and have been very successful. We will miss the old name but now it is time to move forward and focus on being a viable and respected political party. We hope to make a worldwide network of secular organizations.”
First off I should point out that I do not belong to the NAP so I have no right to tell them how to move their agenda forward. As you know I'm not much of a joiner.
However I would like to point out that this smacks of the same kind of insecurity which inspired the Liberals to re-brand themselves as "progressives." Personally I always thought that was a capitulation to the conservative forces which kept trying to vilify liberals.
My attitude was "Fuck them, they're not the boss of me!" And remains so to this day.
I have to say I feel much the same about this. I personally take great pains to point out that I am an Atheist and then, hopefully, give people the opportunity to see that I am not the evil, dangerous, immoral person that many religious people would have you believe that I am.
In fact I believe Atheists to be the moral superior of ANYBODY who claims to be a God fearing individual who lives a moral life due to their superstitious belief that by not doing so they risk being denied heaven and instead will be forced to suffer in agony for eternity.
In my personal view of Atheists I see us as intelligent individuals who have carefully investigated the claims made by the world's religion and found that none of them provided compelling evidence to support their claims, And who furthermore have made the choice to courageously advertise to a world filled with religious and superstitious people that we do not share your need to cling to unprovable dogmatic assertions about reality out of fear of being alone or death.
Caving to pressure from others is to deny who I am would be a betrayal of self, and an act of abject cowardice.
But hey, I wish the "Secular Party of America" great success.
Update: For those questioning my assertion that Atheists are the least trusted and most reviled group on the planet I suggest you educate yourselves by reading here, here, and here.
I am not an atheist, so I wouldn't have any interest in joining an atheist organization. However, I do believe in a secular government, so I would probably support an organization that promotes that regardless of whether or not most members are atheists. Therefore, the name change is more inclusive and supportive of their mission which seems to be to promote secular government rather than to promote atheism.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you. This sounds like a very positive move.
DeleteI also agree that this is a good progressive, proactive move. This opens the doors for people of faith who believe in the separation of church and state, secular government. As long as being an atheist is not a requirement of membership. Down with any political party that includes spiritual beliefs in its name!
DeleteI agree 100%. Being an atheist and having that as your own self-attached label is to say that one's "lack of belief" is the center of one's existence. If you stop and think about it, is it really any one else's business what a person "believes" or "does not believe" ? IMHO, it is those that define themselves by their beliefs ---Catholics, Baptists, Christians, Muslims, etc who view the "others " as the ones to be reviled and hated. I choose not to have the argument with those who hold their belief structure do near and dear to their heart.
DeleteBut the word secular has a specific meaning that we can all share in --- religious people as well as those who are not. It's an inclusive word that many people of faith would support (and DO support) as far as government is concerned and as far as society and culture are involved.
It's like the word "nigger". I think we should claim the word "atheist" as our own, and then bury it, but not let it be used as a perjorative. If someone wants to promote their brand of religiousity, let them do it privately or in their own mosque or church or synagogue or tent on private property, and they can leave it there.
Just think about it, G. I understand what you're daying and I understand why you feel that way, but give this idea some thought. It's okay to be more intelligent than the other guy, but its bad form to tell him how smart you are and how dumb he is. When he figured out that you're smarter and is open to listening to your ideas, he will learn and thus, become smarter in the process. You don't have to run the other guy down in the ground, because if you do, he's not going to listen and learn.
That sort of leads to my point. I agree with you that many if not most of the greatest minds of the greatest scientists and big thinkers of all of human history were not typical believers of one of the 3 great Abrahamic faiths, but they co-existed Nd thrived in a society among a lot of people who were religious, and they managed to teach their contemporaries and generations to follow a lot of stuff that makes our lives a lot better. And very few, only a couple that I can think of (Hitchens, Dawkins, Harris, et al) made their atheism a defining characteristic. But that was really a central part of the livelihood of each of them, to some degree.
You're a smart guy and a big thinker on most things, but you've put yourself in a box on this subject. At least give it some thought, like I said before. You've got an audience here that isn't exclusive of people of varying degrees of faith that are extremely intelligent, and I hate to see you insult them regarding their intelligence just because they are at a different point in their own self-awareness. Many of us came from an religious upbringing that was stable, positive and loving in many ways, and our families and friends are good, kind, compassionate people that are very good people AND they are Christians. I don't believe for a minute that they are good because they are Christian; in many ways, I think that they are good despite the fact that they interact with a lot if poseurs and people that hide their faults behind a religious cloak. But that's more of a human thing, IMO. I happen to be from a religious background, but have evolved to that of what might be referred to as Agnostic. I don't know what I don't know on some things. When I know what I don't know, I will pursue that in order to grow more. That's the classic cycle of learning, which that asshole Donald Rumsfeld butchered in talking in riddles about the justification for the Iraq War.
Anyway, learning is a good thing to be doing continually throughout life. But we have to listen and think in order to learn and grow. Please give it some thought before you discard the ideas. You're too smart not to at least listen to somebody else that's no dummy myself here. Namaste.
BBB
Well said!
DeleteGryphen, for the most part I agree with what you have stated above - with one exception.
ReplyDeleteSorry, but I am not SUPERIOR to anyone in any way.
More educated? Maybe. More open-minded? Perhaps. More free of guilt and fear? Certainly. Less judging of others? I hope so.
But SUPERIOR? No.
No you misunderstand.
DeleteI believe the Atheist to be the MORAL superior to anybody whose morality is based on the carrot and stick approach utilized by most religions.
If you are good only due to fear of punishment, or in anticipation of reward, then you are not good, you are simply adopting a facade of goodness in order to placate your omnipotent omniscient parent figure.
Oh, I understood what you were saying, Gryphen. And I couldn't agree with your 2nd paragraph more.
DeleteI STILL feel, however, that setting one's self up as superior to ANYONE in ANYthing is wrong.
Smart enough to see the logic of what you are saying? Yes. BETTER than those who can't see it? No. Just because I am not STUPID does not make me BETTER - or superior.
"Setting one's self up as superior to ANYONE in ANYthing is wrong."
DeleteWhich is why those religious bullies who have been doing so for thousands of years are wrong.
I am merely pointing out that their argument is fallacious.
I agree with you Leland. It's an incredibly arrogant and also aggressive in a way statement. I would never ever presume myself to be morally superior to anyone. How obnoxious. Sorry
DeleteGryphen.
Also, I am agnostic, not atheist and I also like the new name. I would be more likely to join this although there are other groups. I'm just not a group person, period.
Being Christian doesn't mean that you are only a moral person out of fear. You, Gryphen, are the one who misunderstands. You also are aggressively arrogant about it as you think atheists have the moral high ground. I suspect there are all kinds of people religious and atheists on that moral high ground. It makes me wonder what kind of horridly oppressive religious experience you and/or your daughter had as children. Your attitude is as self-righteous as those religions who believe that only their followers get to go to heaven.
DeleteYes, their argument is fallacious, but you are doing the same thing.
DeleteYes, Gryphen, the bullies HAVE been setting themselves up as morally superior for thousands of years. And that's exactly why we SHOULDN'T do it.
DeleteAnd 10:17? You are correct about SOME christians not being a moral person only out of fear. However, the VAST majority of the people I speak with about my being an atheist (Excuse me, recently converted agnostic, since I can't prove god DOESN'T exist just as they can't prove he DOES) one of the very first questions they ask me is am I not afraid of hell if I am wrong?
Sorry, but that's FEAR talking.
Perhaps I have been clumsy in making my point.
DeleteThe idea of the moral superiority of the religious over the nonreligious is so ingrained in people's DNA that they hardly even notice it.
It just is.
That is why there is no group of people more hated and mistrusted than those who not only do not believe, but who state unequivocally that there is no reason TO believe.
The reason why they are considered so villainous by religious leaders should be obvious, but the question is why are they so mistrusted by the casual person of only rudimentary faith?
Once you understand THAT you will understand why it is so important to speak up in defense of the idea of Atheism.
Leland,
DeleteThat's fear AND ignorance of the Bible talking. Yes, I am a Christian, but I don't take the Bible as the word of God. I know, it's weird. But it is man who wrote it, translated it, and decided what would go in and what would be left out. Sounds like a lot of fallibility to me.
Gryphen,
"The idea of the moral superiority of the religious over the nonreligious is so ingrained in people's DNA that they hardly even notice it. "
Are there any studies to support this statement of yours? Yes, I see that attitude in the GOP and in certain religious groups. Is it over-whelmingly true? I don't know. I would like to know where you acquired the info. Where's the science behind your assertion? I certainly don't feel that way, but then again, I wasn't raised in a hell fire and damnation house.
Gryphen, do you really think that atheists are hated more than Muslims?
DeleteYou must really be feeling the heat up in AK with all the religious nutjobs there. I have lived in conservative and liberal areas of California all my life, and I have never seen or heard hatred of atheists. I have heard religious people express sadness that someone was an atheist, which is really an arrogant attitude IMHO.
I totally believe that you are persecuted as an atheist, but wow, I have never seen it, heard it, or had any of my atheist friends talk about it. So, I'm thinking that it must be more regional in nature. Probably very strong in the Midwest.
BTW, I currently live in a really conservative, redneck, military town, so you would think that kind of persecution would be prevalent here. We have ten different churches on one street, and many others on various other streets.
In Muslim countries Atheists are being locked up or executed by the dozens.
DeleteBeing an Atheist is to be hated by ALL religious groups. Except for a handful of Eastern religions that is.
Concerning your statement made @ 11:35? That is a TOTALLY different argument than that which you make in the body of the original article above. There you clearly state that YOU consider atheists to be the MORAL SUPERIOR to ANYBODY WHO CLAIMS TO BE A GOD FEARING INDIVIDUAL.
DeleteNow you are seemingly reversing and talking about THEIR accepting moral superiority.
I will freely admit that there are some things in which I AM better than others. I am better than SOME in my field of expertise. I am a better bowler than most people (average 231). And so on. By the same token, there are many who are better than me in basketball or gardening or things like that.
But being better or worse than someone at specific things does NOT make me morally superior. In fact it doesn't make me superior in any way. It makes me an individual.
I am NOT superior to ANYone was my original statement. I would like to add something to that: Neither is there someone superior to ME!
I do, however, have to agree with you concerning the fear and hatred of atheists. Historically they ARE one of the most hated and feared. The person who said they were never exposed to that feeling (WakeUpAmerica) is lucky. And his initial question about atheists being hated more than muslims is based entirely on a "current events" emotional situation.
I believe that history can prove that atheists have ben hated as long as there has been organized religion.
I like the change for this reason: Anyone can have secular opinions and values. This opens the party up for people who don't care to label themselves (or who are not actually) atheists, but still work toward government that isn't theocratted up.
ReplyDeleteThis makes the tent bigger and more roomy for people with similar values.
I think it is going to be a long time before they see any positive results from the name change, but mostly because it will still be the Atheist party in most people's minds for quite a while. AND the other parties will still (if not always) attack them from that angle.
DeleteAnd then there is the fear most people will have in the back of their minds about being associated with atheists.
I DO have to say, though, that I wish them well because we NEED their goals to come to fruition.
Blah blah blah
ReplyDeleteMore Palin please.
I found this Jezebel article from Lindy West to hit home, regarding my experience as an Atheist.
ReplyDeletehttp://jezebel.com/how-to-be-an-atheist-without-being-a-dick-about-it-823225375
I found that article to be repellent, and I LIKE Lindy.
DeleteHere's why - http://freethoughtblogs.com/axp/2013/07/18/dont-be-a-dick-new-from-jezebel/
Regarding the title of the article (haven't read it yet), you could replace "be an atheist" with "to express and opinion" and still be spot on. LOL
DeleteNames do matter. Ten years ago I had, for me, a very enlightening conversation with a Muslim woman from Azerbaijan on the streets of Columbia South Carolina. I'm from Maine, so we were both out of our element. As we were walking along, the subject of religion came up and she asked me what I believed in. I said I'm an atheist. She said, well you've got to believe in something. and I began to explain what I believed in. (evolution, science, life, death, decomposition, etc...)
ReplyDeletebut it was then I realized I had to start defining myself on what I believed as opposed to what I didn't believe.
I did some research and now explain to people that I'm a Humanist.
It's simple.
I'm not superstitious.
I like to deal in facts and science, and I realize a lot of questions remain unanswered. But we're working on them.
The Earth does revolve around the sun.
Germs are real.
Politically I am certainly a secularist.
We can't let governments and laws be dictated by superstitions.
I don't think we in America need to have a political party devoted to it though. (But I live in the Northeast)
But my point would be that atheists should start defining themselves by what they believe in as opposed to defining themselves by what they don't believe in.
We are humanists and we demand our government is secular.