"It's not right. It's utterly, utterly evil. Why should I respect a capricious, mean minded, stupid god who creates a world which is so full of injustice and pain?"
I love the interviewers face at the end of this response. He looks like he wants to literally crawl away.
I have so much respect for this man. I cannot begin to tell you.
I have to say that is the most stunned look on an interviewer's face I have ever seen.
ReplyDeleteAnd not only stunned from the honesty, but also shocked at the logic involved that actually seemed to have the asker seriously considering it!
I have seen the same sort of question presented to people who are non-theists and the answer - as returned - didn't have any impact whatsoever on the interviewer.
I would really liked to see the entire interview. Can you provide a link, Gryphen?
The link is in the top frame of the video:)
DeleteThanks, 5:00. I guess I am not used to seeing a link that looked like that.
DeleteThe interviewer is Gabriel ("Gay") Byrne, an Irish broadcasting personality notable for his 32 year stint as host of "The Late Late Show". Byrne is a well-liked interviewer. It is his style to ask the question and let the guest answer fully.
DeleteI think the stunned look is pretty common to anyone that gets the full Stephen Fry effect. The combination of logic, articulation, imagery etc. is mesmerizing.
That was a great interview! Stephen Fry has clearly thought about the topic, has examples to clarify his opinion (the Christian god versus Greek gods, unspeakable suffering causes to the Christian god's creations through cancer and insects), speaks clearly and effectively in complete sentences, and actually answers the question that is asked, demonstrating that 1) he understood the question, and 2) has the focus and intelligence to provide an answer. How the hell can he and Palin be invited to the same event?!?
ReplyDeletePalin and Fry will be at Cambridge University on different days, which is a very lucky thing for Palin.
DeleteStephen Fry is extremely intelligent, educated and well-read. He has a gift for interacting at a level his listeners can understand whatever that level may be.
Fry has a panel show on TV called "QI" (for quite interesting). Occasionally (very occasionally), Fry displays how the more normal intelligence of ordinary humans can fray his nerves. This is a clip where after several patient explanations he finally unloads on a hapless panelist with "you can NOT be that stupid" (about 3:00)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=duqlZXiIZqA
How can a grown man -- the interviewer -- still believe in such a well-described monster that his God is after Fry's brilliant answer? ...but he will. He's just another brainwashed person who has committed intellectual suicide in the name of religion.
ReplyDeleteThe interviewer looks worried that God might strike him down for having a conversation with such a heretic. Priceless.
ReplyDeleteThe Christians will say that Adam and Eve made the fateful decision to eat the apple.
ReplyDeleteTherefore we all inherited the "fallen" world due to their sin, and so all creation suffers because of a major mistake made by them.
Bone cancer in children? Parasites eating your body from the inside out? All due to not obeying God, in the minds of many religious folks.
This is the same mentality of the hateful vicious bigot named Bryan Fischer, who said that the Sandy Hook massacre was caused by lack of school prayer since 1962
http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/fischer-sandy-hook-shooting-proof-americas-moral-capital-has-run-out
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/12/14/1169980/-Bryan-Fischer-blames-shooting-in-CT-on-lack-of-prayer-in-school
It's going to be really interesting to watch $arah Palin (of all people) at Cambridge, if she has any interaction at all with Stephen Fry.
My prediction is that she'll need to cancel last minute, or if she does go, she's going to insist on absolutely NO unscripted questions.
I've loved Fry for a long time, follow him on Twitter as well. What an intelligent and well spoken response. The interviewer asked, he got an answer he really didn't want to hear! Priceless!
ReplyDeleteAlmost a million people have viewed this with 15,000+ liking it and 523 disliking. This video has gone viral. Yeah! It might put a tiny (potent) seed of doubt into a few more young people -- old foggies can't change, if interviewer Byrne's expression is anything to go by --- and his first (smug) riposte to Fry's remarks says it all, "And you think you're going to get in after that?"
ReplyDeleteHe's unreachable.
Even at the end he had no counter argument, just a silly remark.
The Meaning of Life with Gay Byrne, Sunday 1st February, 10.30pm
See more at: http://www.rte.ie/player
Most young folks I know do not attend a church and are not religious!
DeleteThe 'christian' community throughout the USA is lessening which is driving them nuts! I think politics has had a lot to do with the matter in that government and religion do not mix as Republicans continually push on America! To their detriment, I might add.
Most of them do not live Christian lives as their particular doctrines teach! ( i.e. affairs, divorces, illegal acts, do things that are against the laws where some end up in jail, lie, cheat, steal from others, have children out of wedlock, kill, etc.)
I know, but there are the home-schooled (who probably are not allowed access to You-Tube...)
Deleteand Mormon kids (who probably sneak a look) and many others still under their parents' thumbs (made to go to church who need this reassurance they are OK to question).
I want 100% of young people to question the notion of a god -- you gotta have a dream!
You can never convince the unthinking that "God" (take your pick of any of the many) was created by man, and not the other way around.......
ReplyDeleteFry reminds me of the typical person who doesn't understand the difference between country and government or that religion and God are not the same thing.
ReplyDeleteI suppose if I wanted to blame the Operator of the Universe for anything, I would blame It for this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Oxygenation_Event
which makes it possible to have to listen to Fry's ridiculous ideas about some god's lack of creation of an Earthly Utopia. I imagine he wants everyday to be Christmas, too.
orlin sellers
You completely missed his point, which is hardly surprising because all you really are is a barely effectual troll.
DeleteGood luck, orlin sellers, maybe you'll be able to work "yeasty vagina" into this thread.
DeleteStephen Fry and "typical person" is an oxymoron.
DeleteThat's all ya got? Weak.
Deleteorlin sellers
Not nearly as weak as you, Orlin.
DeleteAs you listen to Stephens answer it makes complete sense that there is no god. How could anyone want to believe in a god that is so horrible? I would much rather believe that nature and humans evolved and we are just trying to survive extinction.
ReplyDeleteI think Fry's view of the Greek pantheon of gods is that at least they weren't seen as all "good". Fry's opinion is the current vogue for a "good" God makes that God less believable than more fault ridden deities.
DeleteIn order for someone to believe that god is so horrible, one would have to believe what the bible says.
DeleteHas anyone actually heard from satan on this?
orlin sellers
Zeus is more relevant than "satan". Has anyone actually heard from Zeus on this?
DeleteThis is what is making the righties increasingly crazy because people who have privately abandoned the religions they were indoctrinated into are finding, day after day, that they are far from alone, and in numbers there is empowerment.
ReplyDeleteHe's a typical atheist with no respect for other beliefs.
ReplyDeleteWhy do you really care? If you have Faith, then you believe he's going to burn eternally in a fire pit in Hell. He'll get his, right? If what he says bothers you, maybe your Faith isn't as strong as it should be. I recommend you pray on it.
DeleteWhen others believe that their god allows some children to have bone cancer and other children to be tortured to death by their parents, maybe their beliefs don't deserve that much respect.
DeleteWell done, 8:58. Well done.
DeleteYou realize your dismissal of his opinion is not particularly respectful?
DeleteI'm also an atheist and could care less what my friends or family members believe. Everyone has the right to focus their spiritual or god needs however they want.
DeleteI've been anti religion since being a teenager and I'm a senior citizen today. If anyone ever asks me about going to church, or not doing so, I just answer 'I don't believe!' And, rarely has my response been questioned, which has always amazed me!
All these responses are great!
DeleteYou mean like the good Christians who burn down churches, mosque, synagogue and who stone little Muslim children who only want to sing the national anthem?
DeleteRespect other religions like Bryan Fischer, Pat Robertson, Mike Huckabee respect other religions?
You are an id'jit.
I don't believe in god either! I'm in my 70's now and began questioning the religion that was forced down my throat as a young teenager. (Catholic, of course!) I was actually grounded by my mother if I didn't attend Mass every Sunday which drove me friggin' nuts!
ReplyDeleteNever could understand how an atheist can have an opinion on God! They don't believe in God. How can you hate someone who in your opinion doesn't exist. And........surely, if you think there is a God to blame...there must also be a devil or satan. Blame the right being if you are going to blame anyone and understand the whole Truth.
ReplyDeleteI don't hate a non-existent being that some people call God. It would be silly to hate something that doesn't exist.
DeleteI don't even hate the morons that spend a few thousand hours telling me that I was headed to hell. It is silly to hate morons.
I do hate people that toss around terms like "the whole Truth" (capitalizing Truth no less) because they seek only to comfort themselves, not inform me of anything of value. That sort of person needs to pacifier not an intelligent partner in discourse.
Props to Stephen Fry.
ReplyDeleteI've heard that argument before. I've made that argument before. But never as eloquently as Stephen Fry.
It's the Epicurean Riddle on steroids. If god expects humans to adhere to a set of moral standards, why doesn't he? If he can't or won't live up to the standards he expects of his creation, then by what moral right can he sit in judgment of humanity?
Powerful stuff.
How can you know happiness and joy without knowing what sorrow and misery are? If Fry was living in a drought-stricken area he'd want rain on a sunny day. No should ever have to experience the devastation of tornados, hurricanes, floods, or drought. god is evil for causing those things.
ReplyDeleteIf there is a god, please let he/she/it be a Seahawks fan.
ReplyDeleteAfter 12 years of Catholic indoctrination, I decided, "Who am I to know the unknowable?" and I have been agnostic ever since. Four of my six siblings, however, became evangelical Christians and they are hell-bent on getting me into heaven. All I have to do is accept Jesus as my lord and savior and I'm in. I tell them that if that's how it works, their heaven is the last place I'd ever want to be. I don't want to spend eternity with anyone who is so judgmental about my healthy skepticism (them!), and I can't possibly believe in a god who would set things up that way.
ReplyDelete@10:17 I was brought up in a fairly liberal protestant church, with parents who took their Christianity seriously (as in trying to follow the teachings of Jesus, rather than believing the tales of a vengeful God in the OT). As a teenager I became a secret agnostic, but when I started studying world religions and how they began, I came to understand that all religions are the creation of man, fulfilling the needs of societies -- and especially those whose leaders need to exert control. I'm not even able to support the idea of an "each to their own" belief system, because it inevitably leads to an "us versus them" construct. History tells us this is so. I truly welcome people like Stephen Fry who are willing to speak their minds, regardless of what the rest of society thinks.
DeleteSo happy to read this. I long ago gave up any belief in God. But after years of dithering, and feeling guilty and flawed, I finally realized I had no faith or belief in Buddhism as well (after practicing for several years). The beginning of my break with Buddhism was triggered by the sexual misconduct of several highly placed monks and nuns, one of whom was my teacher. In the aftermath of those scandals, the tradition I studied in became increasingly cult like. I now feel fortunate I escaped.
ReplyDeleteI consider myself spiritual. I understand that not every thing of power can be seen. I have faith in my work and in my essential goodness. And yes, I'm an atheist.
I respect those who sincerely follow a spiritual path, so long as it is non violent and doesn't seek to deny rights to others.
Top comment.
DeleteFor 2 hours of Christopher Hitchens and Stephen Fry on god (by way of discussion of Blasphemy laws). The intellectual level is high, I can listen it to in only 10-15min chunks. (The moderator is very annoying.)
ReplyDeletehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HMGhvhp078
Fabulous! Wonderful! Loved it! Thank you!
ReplyDeleteFuck that atheist butt-plugger.
ReplyDeleteAww, someone has some unresolved homosexual feelings. Nice of you to share them with us here. We can help you through that.
Delete@5:13
Delete+1
Can't agree more, especially the part about children's suffering and our obligation to spend our lives on our knees thanking him. The man is absolutely correct.
ReplyDeleteA silly question gets an even sillier answer. So much profound thought has been given to these topics over the centuries, it's surprising that anyone dares to make public such a shallow approach. Can they not read? What has prevented their understanding of God from progressing beyond childhood's sky-fairy image?
ReplyDeleteEvery time I see a video of Stephen Fry (which is rare these days) I remember some wag defining him as a stupid person's idea of an intelligent person. This description has become so ubiquitous, it may be difficult to trace its origin with certainly, but certainly the shoe fits.
Fry clearly has no knowledge of theology, but that doesn't stop him from making sweeping judgments which are just as poorly reasoned as those of some fundamentalist Christians. Augustine and Aquinas are probably too much for him now, but modern thinkers like Merton, Tillich, Barth, and Niebuhr might be within his grasp. My suspicion is that he doesn't care. He seems content to make vapid remarks which leave a segment of the population impressed with his keen insight. Entertainers like Fry provide laughs, but they also contribute to the dumbing-down of our culture.
Well, by all means, go ahead and enlighten the very simple, stupid Stephen Fry and all of use even simpler, stupider people who think he's smart. We are obviously too dumb to even dip out toes in anything more than the most superficial understanding of theology. We need a very smart person such as yourself to be our guide and maybe, MAYBE, we won't be so dumb. Maybe, MAYBE, we can come to see why the idea of an all-powerful sky god isn't just a fairytale. But, probably not, since such a thing is clearly beyond our feeble grasp.
Delete