The political committee Abolish Abortion Florida (AAFL) has launched a ballot initiative to amend the state's constitution to punish abortion as capital murder. Under the proposed amendment, anyone who performs or procures an abortion would be charged with first degree, pre-meditated murder. "Abortion" would include any abortifacient drug or device that can kill an embryo by preventing implantation, as well as the intentional destruction of unwanted IVF embryos. The amendment would define life as beginning at fertilization rather than "conception," and declares that "abortion deprives an innocent human being of the inalienable right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."
According to AAFL, the idea is not only to collect enough signatures to get the measure onto the 2018 ballot, but also to encourage legislators to begin putting forward legislation to abolish abortion instead of merely regulating it. Per AAFL: "The Supreme Court cannot make murder legal. Pro-life politicians have passed incremental regulations for decades, but it's time to abolish abortion by recognizing it for what it is – cold-blooded murder – and prosecuting it accordingly."
This law could literally see a woman who took a morning after pill arrested and charged with murder. And then if convicted she could face the death penalty.
So much for being pro-life.
This is what happens when religion decides morality and puts laws on the books.
(H/T to The Friendly Atheist.)
It is these zealots who would force women who would not otherwise has ever considered abortion until they contracted the Zika virus due to no fault of their own, to bear children with such ill-formed brains that they would never, ever be able to live anything close to what could be called a human life. Tiny brain development not only effects physical and mental capability, but personality as well. It's a horrible, horrible thing.
ReplyDeleteThis is where a concept you'd think religious people would understand comes in called mercy. In my view, abortion in these and similar cases is the kinder, more merciful choice. I couldn't imaging being pregnant with a child that I know would be born in such a condition and being told by the government that I had no option but to birth it and care for it until it dies naturally outside the womb. And please zealots, don't give us this 'well, you can give it up for adoption' nonsense, because that's what it is, nonsense.
I'm in Florida and I truly believe this proposed amendment will not even make it to the ballot, if it does, it will go down pretty much in flames. It saddens me however to also think that our short legislative session might be taken up with this kind of garbage when we have environmental disasters we need to focus on, as well as a myriad of other things so much more important to all Floridians.
Well said 4:50!
DeleteAnd the Rethug Congress went on vacation without funding for spraying for Zika. Apparently this week they included money in the budget for it - after the horse is out of the barn.
DeleteRethug down ballot ticket politicians hopefully will be booted out of office. Vote blue ALL the way down the ticket!
The only "forcing" these laws do is to make poor women have babies. NO ONE is trying to make laws to prevent women with means and leisure from going to Canada (and elsewhere) for safe, legal, private, affordable abortions.
DeleteNot even the most rabid forced birther is willing to make women pee on a stick at the airport or border to prevent a fetus from getting to a country with SANE laws about women's health. Rabid forced birthers love to rant, but don't really give a shit about what wealthy women do with their bodies.
This about FORCING poor women to incubate babies so they can be SLUT SHAMED. The Christian Bible is their guide. But this being the 21st century they can't go with the all-time favorite of STONING the SLUTS to death.
Ask any forced birther you meet to defend not trying to prevent women going to Canada for an abortion. They can only sputter. Because ranting about changing United States law is all they know. It's what the g'damn preacher tells them. LOGIC is beyond their capacity because they've been kept in an infantile state of mindless acceptance by their religion, their family, their education and their society. And they are happy to be ignorant little followers of the religious leaders that manipulate them.
Sounds like there will be lots of ZIKA babies in trash dumpsters if they get their way in this.
Delete@10:05AM
DeleteSadly, besides the fetuses in dumpsters, there will be women dying in agony from botched abortions.
If you were around before Roe V. Wade, you knew women that had back alley abortions. Well, you knew the ones that lived. At that time, many men were oblivious to the fact that women were able to get (unsafe) abortions. Cloud cuckoo land.
I want to be crystal clear - there is nothing in the Christian bible that forbids abortion, and three (that I found) passages which advocate the use of 'bitter water' aka abortifacients.
ReplyDeleteAs liberal people know, this move is not about life but control of the wimmenz. Anyone who says different is lying to themselves.
Well said, Connie; there is NO abortion prohibition in the Christian Bible.
DeleteThis crowd simply wants their baseless opinions to carry the weight of law.
"...there is nothing in the Christian bible that forbids abortion, and three (that I found) passages which advocate the use of 'bitter water' aka abortifacients."
Deleteyou will NEVER convince those fools of that because you will be hit with something like, "well, you're not reading the right bible."
Just another example of the blind being edumacated (deliberate misspelling!) by those who want only to control people.
The Christian Bible (in all its endless translations and transformations) is chock full to the brim with HOW TO CONTROL WOMEN. It is a fine handbook for abusers.
DeleteWho bothers to nitpick whether the word abortion hasn't been winnowed out by all the men that distorted the translations for their own political and sexual satisfaction.
AND, furthermore, if the Christian Bible(s) did advocate for abortion (it already has a ton of reasons for killing) then the "religious" leaders would find some other venue to CONTROL women. They need to CONTROL women and they will damn well find a way to do it.
The Christian Bible details the rules for selling a daughter into slavery. The only value of the Christian Bible is to supply skit material for Comedy Central, Saturday Night Live, etc.
DeleteAdditionally, the Christian bible is very clear that life doesn't begin until the first breath is drawn. Fetuses don't breathe.
DeleteLet them bring on more Krazy Kristian Krap...it's going so well in North Carolina.
ReplyDelete...and with all the young folks abandoning the church and its hate as fast as they can.
Right, get it all out. Poisonous thinking, to be sure.
DeleteHow many of these radical "pro-life" people are signed-up to adopt and care for children born with severe disabilities?
ReplyDeleteAnd how many of them want universal health care, child care, family care leaves, and better public education legislation? None of them. I suppose.
DeleteBeaglemom
What about executing George Zimmerman? His actions " deprived an innocent human being of the inalienable right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." I know, they're comic book collectors, and the product only has worth in the original wrapper.
ReplyDeleteThis is not so far-fetched. A complete ban on abortion would bring that (hypothetical) new statute into direct conflict with existing Stand Your Ground laws and even just plain Self Defense.
DeleteThe problem is that these people do not seem to understand the difference between the words "kill" and "murder". "Kill" is pretty straight forward: The cockroach was alive, I stepped on it, it died, my action deprived it of life, I killed the cockroach.
But what murder is is a defined sub-set of killing. Here are some types of killing that we currently do not define as murder: 1) Executions (death penalty for crimes); 2) Killing military operatives of nations we are at war with; 3) Police or other LEOs killing persons committing or about to commit a crime; 4) Persons killing in situations where if they did not, they themselves would likely be killed.
Seems like a lot of people who abhor abortion have no trouble with the killing above.
Now, I know the anti-abortion crowd tries to make the distinction that the person being killed in the above descriptions 'deserves it' whereas the unborn is an innocent. They say "But your baby could grow up to be Einstein". Well, if brought up in poverty or the foster care system, it's actually more likely your baby will grow up to be Ted Bundy. You can't play the "He could be a great artist" card when he could also equally (if not more potentially due to economic circumstances) become the guy who is going to grow up and rape and murder someone's daughter. Believe you me, there are parents out there who wish certain people had never been born.
What I don't get on board with is a Federal or State or even local government telling people, telling women, that there is not ever, any reason for having an abortion, particularly if they cite religious reasons for that stance. In my very Christian-based morality, I find the practice of abortion to be something that should always be available as a choice in most circumstances out of a concept called mercy - If you have been infected with the Zika virus and your doctor shows you sonograms of extremely low brain development, or if a terrible infection occurs late in pregnancy that threatens the life of both mother and child. I guess the only reservation I would have is restricting abortion if the fetus has gestated sufficiently to live outside of the womb without mechanical intervention - in other words, if the baby can live outside of the mother's body without having to be attached to a ventilator or other technological device.
I know I've been rambling, but this is a complicated subject. Hope y'all found something useful in this.
Gee, MarvinM, it almost sounds like you think you should make a decision because the woman with the FETUS doesn't know enough to handle her own body. You list your rules as if the WOMAN with the FETUS is just another object for you to make rules about.
DeleteAnd those rules you want to make, do you give a shit whether the women that can LEAVE the USA and ignore your rules are ONLY the women with the money and time to do so?
Maybe what you need to do is to change the rules in all the other countries in the world so that you can make rules in the USA which will control American women. Because pondering the restrictions for just poor women looks a little, er, sort of, well ya know, kinda s t u p i d.
"available as a choice in most circumstances out of a concept called mercy - If you have been infected with the Zika virus and your doctor shows you sonograms of extremely low brain development, or if a terrible infection occurs late in pregnancy that threatens the life of both mother and child...."
DeleteOr, gosh, maybe you were RAPED and don't want the rapist to torment you for 18 years over parental rights. Such a merciful thing.
9:42, those were just examples. Nothing I wrote or even implied excluded rape victims. I agree with you, a woman should not have to bear a child conceived by rape, but my post was already really really long. I've gotten slammed before for writing posts that were considered 'too long'. I know that a lot of people don't even bother to read long posts. So, thank you for reading mine, but really, we are on the same page. This is an extremely complex issue, your point is absolutely relevant, but the fact that I did not bring it up in my post does not mean I am your enemy. We are on the same side of this issue.
DeleteNo, MarvinM, we are no way in hell on the same page. I want the paramount concern to be what the woman with the fetus in her wants. I want her decisions to be NOT influenced by her financial resources. I want her decisions to be NOT influenced by the circumstances that caused said fetus. AND, most of all, I want her to not have to listen to OTHER people tell her she's not good enough to decide for herself.
DeleteMaybe you were slammed for reasons other than the length of your comments, but you weren't quick enough on the uptake to notice.
9:35, you wrote
Delete"Gee, MarvinM, it almost sounds like you think you
should make a decision because the woman with the
FETUS doesn't know enough to handle her own body.
Where in my post did I write anything like that?
I didn't.
"You list your rules as if the WOMAN with the FETUS is
just another object for you to make rules about."
I didn't list 'my rules'. I can only assume you
misunderstood my post and I'm sorry I was not more
clear. I think we are actually on the same ideological
side.
So it concerns me that you are apparently angry
with me about an issue that we probably agree on -
abortion rights. If there was something in my post
that you thought undermined the cause of keeping
abortion legal, then, I am all for listening to that, and
I wish you'd just tell me what about my post you
thought was not helpful to the pro-choice movement
and why.
Your "concern" is duly noted.
DeleteYou made many good points Marvin. Thank you. Sorry you were treated so rudely.
DeleteAbortion should be on demand, at any time, for any reason or no reason at all. Fuck Marvin and his "mercy" and complex issues". It is not complex at all. If a woman does not want to be pregnant and finds herself in that situation, she should have fast, easy, inexpensive access to abortion.
Delete@6:14
DeleteExactly right.
I told a Republican friend that this kind of stuff was happening, and they refused to believe it. The evangelicals are nuts, especially any female that puts up with these hateful edicts. I'm sure Bristol's GW will be all over this 'wonderful, Christian, child-loving' bill, while managing to take a few pokes at Hillary and Democrats. Have at it. This is wrong, and for these folks to claim they are for individual rights and small government is pathetic.
ReplyDeleteIf they watch only Fox News they will probably never hear of any of these crazy things because I suspect Fox would not report on it.
DeleteBTW, I know only one person who is right wing crazy. But, she only watches Fox and does not know anything about any number of issues I learn about in the "regular" media or the "left leaning media". When I mention this to her she just says "no can't be". when I send her articles from any median source she says "they are left-leaning and can't be trusted". It is a loosing situation I fear. Fox News should be banned from being on air.
I'm surprised that all the words on that sign were spelled correctly.
ReplyDeleteWhat does Accessories ? mean?
DeleteI don't understand the sign at all.
It's calling doctors accessories to murder. Basically, in Wingnutia, you can have a sign where the meaning is clear OR where all the words are spelled right, but make no sense. They cannot pull off both at the same time.
DeleteFuck these assholes. If they really cared about preventing abortion they would sanction the morning after pill, and not be hell bent on restricting access to birth control. The want to LEGISLATE MORALITY.
ReplyDeleteFrom my research into the Other Side, the morning after pill, as well as birth control, are considered to be equal to an abortion.
DeleteNo logic, just emotive talking points
Some "morning after" things prevent an embryo from implanting in the uterus. It is not even a fetus yet. I tried to explain that to a oh-so kind, caring Christian man. And he let out with a hellfire rant to rival the best of old time preachers. It must have soothed the twinge in his little, tiny, itsy-bitsy penis.
DeleteWhat are "accessories" in this billboard? These religious fundamentalists have the same hate as that expressed by the Muslim fundamentalists. No difference between the two camps - both want to control everyone else and be in charge of the world. Extremism is bad no matter where it raises its ugly head!
ReplyDeleteI believe accessories is an indirect dig at Planned Parenthood and all the people who work there.
DeleteNo war on women? Ha!
The battle continues and won't end until the Domionists are firmly defeated.
O/T
ReplyDeleteWas trump on cocain?
All the sniffling and snorting at debate
Margot
That's what people are saying...a lot of people I'm hearing say that. It's YUGE!
Delete624, that is all the proof I need.
DeleteTrump has made it clear what he means when he says "Many people are saying that".
The Federal Law authorizing abortions will override a state law they try to put on their books.
ReplyDeleteMore hype from that state as usual!
@ 6:27
DeleteIf Humpty Trumpty gets elected, the first time an opening occurs on the SCOTUS, he will try to appointment an anti-abortionist on the bench and if that happens, these freaks will simply demand it go to the top court - where they will possibly win.
One of the top 3 reasons for me to vote for Hillary.
I'm 6:27 AM - in response to 7:34 AM - I so agree that voting for Hillary Clinton is our ONLY choice for POTUS in November. For so MANY reasons!
DeleteFor the reason 6:27 wrote above, this would never get on a ballot. This is just about reving up anti-abortion people.
ReplyDeleteMen who want to control women. It's a conspiracy from the right wingers to make women wear long skirts, tall hair, and keep their legs spread. Talk about porn. Look, men, it's time we talked about you keeping your' pecker to yourself if your gonna tell us what to do with ours. No wonder you support Donald Trump. You want women to bow down yet you hate women who wear shrouded faces. Make up your effin minds. You want women to stay one step below you, bottom line. Period. Finis.
ReplyDelete"Look, men, it's time we talked about you keeping your' pecker to yourself if your gonna tell us what to do with ours."
DeleteExcuse me, 7:24, but kindly do NOT bunch all of us men into that category!
Too bad this isn't all about gun control than abortion control. Talk about depriving innocent humans...
ReplyDeleteOr grant "redemption in the "prison system" to be forgiven.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.rawstory.com/2016/09/texas-prisons-ban-books-by-shakespeare-and-langston-hughes-but-hitler-and-david-duke-are-ok/
Since these radicalized christianists are about the MOST immoral group of people on this planet, this has nothing to do with morality,it's about POWER.
ReplyDeleteRighto, let's jail women that miscarry because they can't PROVE they didn't have an abortion. El Salvador does that. Time for the good ole USA to join the true crusade to control women.
ReplyDeleteThe sign needs a coda. "I will force a 12 year old rape victim to carry a fetus to term because the god I invented in my head is supposed to be merciful."
ReplyDeleteOne woman is raped behind the dumpster in her apartment complex. Another woman's partner fouls up the condom somehow.
ReplyDeleteIf you think the rules about abortion should be different for these two women because YOU have morals, then you need some serious re-training in logic because your brain is malfunctioning. (Or you are inherently evil.)
The cause of an unwanted pregnancy is a sperm.
ReplyDeleteAny man that puts sperm into a woman that isn't fully committed to bringing a fetus to term has a chance at causing an UNWANTED PREGNANCY.
When a woman wants an abortion, just give it to her for christ's sake. Then jail the guy that caused the UNWANTED pregnancy. He is the real problem.
Exactly.
DeleteTwo people are injected with something that will siphon sustenance from their body from 9 months, exude hormones to supply breast milk, and grow to be 8-10lbs before being forced out of their body through an orifice.
ReplyDeleteOne of those people has the money to go to Canada and have it removed. The other is legally restrained by the threat of prison from doing anything but watch the thing grow.
Which person do you want to be? Whose god do you want deciding? Why do you think you have any rights but to sit and watch it grow?
Every Bible, Christian and non-Christian alike, knows that forcing a woman to have a baby instantly transforms her into someone physically, mentally, emotionally, financially capable of a 9 month stint hosting a parasite, and handling the subsequent hits to health and finances. Bibles sure do have all the answers.
ReplyDeleteI'm anti-forced birth.
ReplyDeleteIn a world before Roe V. Wade my mother had 3 children in 3 years. She frequently told me how desperately she wanted to abort me and how much better her life would have been if only she could have gotten an abortion.
Forcing my mother to have me was WRONG (but very, very, very Christian).
The funny thing is that when I mention my history to people they invariably disparage my mother. Evidently my father is completely blameless.
Go figure.
@11:27, I am very sorry to hear of your experience. I support every woman's right to choose but I must say that your mother was very cruel in telling you how badly she wanted to abort you. No child should hear that from a parent. She could have expressed her support for reproductive rights without making it personal. My own mother behaved similarly, conveying her disappointment that I was not a boy. I was fortunate to have a father thrilled with a third daughter but it still hurts. I don't know much to say to comfort you, but I do wish you peace.
Delete@8:49
DeleteMy mother was not wrong or cruel. If a 3rd child in 3 years can't figure out they were not wanted, then they aren't very bright.
Every women that is forced to give birth must handle it in her own way. Making her give birth then telling her she must not mention that she didn't want the baby, is just another layer in the whole forced-birth cruelty racket.
Where in the Christian Bible does it say stick your nose in a woman's reproductive rights all you want. George Carlin said it best "How come all the pro lifers are folks no one would want to fork in the first place?".
ReplyDeleteSad to say it, but we're headed for more killings like the Tiller case if these "christians" don't stop their rabid bullshit.
I'll assume they know this is unconstitutional and they will just be wasting tax payer money, one way or another.
ReplyDeleteAre the dumbshits in Florida really okay with their tax dollars being wasted like this?
Thus answering the age-old question: What would Jeebus do?
ReplyDeleteKill abortion providers, of course.
For starters, anyways.
This is really upsetting to me as a woman. I used various birth control when I was younger. After having my second child my husband and I sat down and talked about family planning. We decided that we couldn't afford anymore children at the time so I had gone with the IUD. It worked very well. Once it was time to have it removed I decided not to go back on it for various reasons. I'm going to spare you the main reason. Shortly after I got pregnant when the condom broke. After the birth of our third child my now ex-husband had a vasectomy. Although I had a few problems with the IUD, I'm grateful that I had that option. I honestly believe that if I didn't have the IUD or if my ex didn't have a vasectomy that I would have had 6 or more kids. This law would have outlawed IUD and would have put people like me in jail with the possibility that I would have been put to death while my husband at the time would have to take care of our kids. He wouldn't go to jail. Why do we want to punish women for choices make in family planning but guys get a pass?
ReplyDelete